I don't know if he sees them or not. It would be possible to refer to them in some sort of message sent to him.

You have a few options, each with different repercussions.

1. Message Jan in the form that I suggested. Morally it's a tiny wrong for you to lie, but if she has any ounce of humanity in her she will feel bad and possible seek atonement, this is the best way for you to try and FIX the relationship.
2. Confront Jan. If you are wrong you will have either harmed your relationship with Jan or made yourself look like a fool. On the plus side, if you can do this privately, women (as well as men) are less prone to be deceptive in face-to-face situations, so you might have a chance of her feeling guilty. At which point you have leverage against her, because you know her secret.
3. Confront Paul. He won't be happy, he will be mad at you. If you are wrong, you've fucked up big time.
4. Do nothing.

You are thinking to linearly. Reactions and emotions are WAYYY more complicated then you are making them out to be. You seem to be ignoring the fact that you will be crushing a man's love, and he'd much rather question YOU and YOUR motives rather than actually confront the idea that his love is fake. Imagine this...

You walk up to Paul, and awkwardly introduce yourself quickly, and then immediately carry the conversation to "I think there might be something wrong with Jan" or "Jan seems to be talking to Jack a lot lately" or "Jack is going after your woman, man". No matter what you do, he will IMMEDIATELY feel distaste and anger. How he vents it is dependent on who he is as a person. He isn't going to roll over and "thank" you for "helping" him. If you tell a person that their girlfriend is cheating on them, or even allude to the idea, you will sew seeds of doubt and destroy any trust in the relationship. You will be inevitably destroying the relationship, whether you are right or wrong. If you want to destroy the relationship but risk getting the shit beat out of you, by all means, talk to Paul.

What you are trying desperately to convince yourself is okay to do is, in fact, not okay to do. Most relationships involve cheating at some point in time, by one party or the other. Why is it you feel compelled to insert yourself into this particular man's life, and inform him of something you don't know is even true? Why would you go out of your way to cause insecurity or worse in a relationship where you don't know either party? What right do you have?

That's right, you have none. It doesn't concern you. It's none of your business.

I mean, do you really not understand what "your business" includes? You seem to have some serious issues with understanding boundaries and what is considered socially acceptable.


This is the correct answer.

You've already been told the right answer in a dozen different ways. You either have problems with literacy, are learning impaired, or you're just a narcissist that places no weight in what other people say.

You are going out of your way to needlessly involve yourself in the lives of two people who don't know you, ipso facto, you need to get a life. I suggest seeing a psychiatrist to help you get through whatever your personal issues are at the root of this situation, it would be a much more productive and positive use of your time.

I didn't actively go and find out what is happening between Jan and Jack, I was just told about mainly from my girlfriend, as I like hearing what's bothering her when something is wrong.

You've heard of the phrase "Sin of omission", have you not? You say it's wrong to not mind my own business, what if I say it's wrong to not inform Paul? Informing Paul could possibly lead to a prevention of and repentance of Jan. Informing Paul could lead to anything, is the point. Informing Paul won't necessarily lead to an ending in the relationship, whereas Jan cheating almost certainly would.

I don't think anyone would say "It's none of your business" if I thought Jan was planning to murder Jack. Though, isn't cheating on someone also "wrong", similar to how murdering someone is? Why would it be wrong of me to inform Jack of a possible cheating by Jan, but not wrong to inform Jack of a possible murdering by Jan?

Also, I could say I would want someone to inform me were I in Jack's situation, thus making my actions more altruistic than anything else (as Neki pointed out).

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Oct 18 2010, 6:03 pm by CecilSunkure.

Logic fail.

Dammit Cecil.

1. Who are you to judge another man's relationship when you're so new and naive to the scene yourself? How can you say a girl is being unfaithful to her relationship when you can't even prove your suspicion. How can you know that such actions aren't acceptable in her current situation? Maybe Paul and Jan have affairs with other people, but know about them, understand them, and accept them because they feel that such things don't get in the way of their relationship. What if Jan is just playing your "asshole" buddy for a fool because Paul overheard him saying some shit and thought it'd be funny to mess with him? You don't know what's going on. You are wrong to assume that you know how things should be. You are wrong to think that this is your business at all. You're not a counselor, you're not either of these people's friends or family, you're not anything.

2. Develop your own damn morals and learn to think for yourself. Asking internet people about such a dumb issue is pathetic.

3. What is "wrong" is subjective. I expected university man to know these things.... You disappoint me, cecil.

I wouldn't say she is. I would share my concern that it seems she is.

I'm not assuming I know how things should be. I would be letting Paul know that I have a great suspicion of Jan cheating on him, despite what that actually means in their relationship.

Okay, I don't have any credentials that make this "my business", though you still haven't shown why it is "wrong" for me to share my concern, especially if I would want someone to do the same for me.

Again, massive failure in logic. I guess you didn't understand the last time this was pointed out?

Stop saying "It's justifiable because I'd want the same done if the situation were reversed." It is yet another failing of the narcissistic mindset you continue to present, believing that another person's preferences are secondary to your own. You have no idea what he wants because you do not know him at all, so stop assuming he must share the same opinions that you do.

Most people, believe it or not, do not want a random stranger to come up to them and say "I think your significant other may be cheating on you." You have no place to voice that concern. I know you think extraordinarily highly of yourself, but stop acting like you'd be doing him some kind of favor. He is not your friend or even your acquaintance.

The fact you think it's your place to tell him your opinion on this is, quite frankly, disturbing.

What could you possibly hope to gain by telling Paul anything? If Jan is actually cheating on him, then I suppose I would want to know if I were in Paul's situation, but I would in no means have any thanks for the bearer of the bad news. And if you're wrong, you just fucked up big time. Paul isn't your friend; it's none of your business what's going on between him, his girlfriend, and any other number of men. Maybe Jan isn't as classy as you all think. It's none of your business.

Mostly just echoing everyone else here.

Well, I wouldn't want to gain anything, or plan to gain anything. It's really, really obvious that she either is going to or already is (almost positive she already is) cheating on him; it's a small risk that Jan isn't actually cheating.

ATTN: Azrael is actually Jack!

Buy her two tickets to a game, and then a week or so after the game ask Paul how it was. If he says, "What game?" then you can explain that you gave Jan two tickets and thought she would take him.

Chances are, you'll be $30 poorer and Paul is going to enjoy watching a game.

I actually really like this idea, besides the fact that Jan can choose to bring anyone to a game, like her immediate family, friends or even a random person. That's not an indication on her character because she doesn't take Paul, that's more an indication of taste in my mind. At any point, Cecil bringing this up any of this in any form whether it be through anonymous messages or by showing the facebook messages or by informing Paul of the rumours will at the very least disrupt the trust between Paul and Jan; if Cecil is willing to take that risk, then it's entirely up to him. If the couple break up because of it, I don't think that their relationship was a very strong one because if every relationship were to break up because of mistrust than we'd have no relationships. Assuming that the couple are actually still interested and devoted to each other, they should be able to talk out this problem with each other like adults. Otherwise, then it would have failed regardless of what Cecil is trying to do.

It really bothers me how conditioned we are to ignore problems because of our selfish role in them.

I'm sure just about every one of us would absolutely want to know if we were in Paul's position, and yet none of us would have the balls to actually be the one to tell him. It's pathetic. And yet we try to rationalize it with the stupid bullshit you can see above: "maybe they're not actually cheating yet" or "maybe Paul doesn't want to know." Really? I'm just as guilty myself, a similar thing happened to me at a friend's college and I didn't tell the guy until he confronted me a few hours later. I hope I would've told him before I left, but I don't know.

With that said, a lot of the time it's the sad truth that it's just not worth it to speak up because our society no longer values decency. I'd like to think that I'd drop Paul a note or a message on Facebook, but I guess you never can be sure. The thing people are kind of ignoring is that you can also confront Jan about this, and assuming she isn't a stuck up bitch she'd probably be willing to hear you out.

It bothers me how someone could be so self-important that they feel they need to involve themselves in the lives of complete strangers by going out of their way to share unwarranted advice about their relationship.


What a totally biased, inappropriate, and inaccurate way of phrasing that. Way to misconstrue everyone else


How is that relevant at all? The guy he's talking about is someone he does not know, and who does not know him.


No one is ignoring it. Maybe you should try reading the thread. He doesn't know either person involved, he can't "confront Jan" because he doesn't even know where she lives or where to go to see her in person.

What you're ignoring is that it isn't his place to go confronting people over what he perceives to be a romantic slight against a stranger from another stranger. If it was his friend involved, then yeah, this conversation would be relevant. As it stands, he has no place whatsoever to involve himself. You need to stop throwing your pseudo-moral tantrum and try to learn something called personal boundaries.

I suppose though, there's no use trying to reason with people like this. They could be stalking a woman and convince themselves they're doing something righteous because they're just making sure nothing happens to her. Then they would make some totally irrelevant social commentary about how they're bothered by the way we're conditioned to ignore one another, and then say they wish someone would look out for them the same way.

I know where both of them live, and I do know Jan. I have Jan on Facebook, and it would be easy to get a hold of her.

I'm also friends with Jack. I forgot to mention this.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Oct 18 2010, 9:26 pm by CecilSunkure.

You don't know either person. You're barely an acquaintance to one, and not even that to the other. You're basically stalking them as it is, gathering information on them and watching her Facebook page and checking who she talks to and seeing what she says and making threads about the two of them. You've already crossed a boundary that makes what you're doing creepy at best. Now you're asking if you should stop just being a voyeur and physically involve yourself in their life.

The answer is no, you should not. You should take about five steps backwards and involve yourself even less.

That is the correct answer, based on all social norms and generally accepted etiquette. What you do is up to you.

Almost all relationships do end up failing, though. It only takes a small pebble to snowball into a giant boulder. If it took a lot to start the end of a relationship, then we'd have a more reasonable divorce rate. Something like 50% of what is supposed to be considered "forever" doesn't say much for what is a little less concrete.


The heck are you even talking about... Did you even read everything? This guy isn't his FRIEND. Your examples do not follow the same form as his problem. The entire argument is that it would NOT be socially acceptable or reasonable for him to speak up, not the other way around.

The difference between murder and cheating on someone is that if you stop a murder you're a hero, if you stop a breakup you could be making a mistake. Norm is right 100%. Everyone on here thinks you shouldn't talk to Paul. Go talk to jack, ask him if he's bangin any new hoes. Every guy likes to brag right? Easier said than done though =P.

Of course most relationships end up failing, not every single relationship you enter with a person do you expect to end up with marriage. Some people enjoy the thrill of the relationship, while others enjoy the intimate company it provides. Very few people (at least at younger ages) go into a relationship to find someone they can marry, they go into a relationship because they're either physically or emotionally attracted to them. What I'm trying to say here is that a strong relationship between two people should be built on trust and loyalty. If the relationship is weak enough to crumble under the pressure of rumors or silly facebook posts, then I doubt there was any sort of serious relationship there to begin with. If you're in a relationship, you should be able to talk to your partner seriously about your feelings and your doubts and about how you feel about them without being scared that because of these kinds of conversations that you'll end the relationship prematurely. I think a better idea might be trying to talk to Jake Cecil, ask him what's going on between him and Jan and tell him you're worried about the health of the relationship of Jan and Paul and see how Jake reacts.