Staredit Network > Forums > Null > Topic: Kame Mafia: "Kame Classic" Edition II
Kame Mafia: "Kame Classic" Edition II
Jul 15 2013, 6:19 pm
By: Fire_Kame
Pages: < 1 9 10 11 12 >
 

Aug 12 2013, 10:16 pm Leeroy_Jenkins Post #201



I vote for raitaki.

Quote
**To clarify what I mean by majority, here are some scenarios:
3 Mafia Vote for Sac, 1 Abstains: Sac Dies
2 Mafia Vote for Sac, 1 Votes for Azrael, 1 Abstains: Sac Dies
1 Mafia Votes for Sac, 1 Votes for Azrael, 1 Votes for Demon, 1 Votes for Aristocrat: First vote into me dies.**

As you can see, in the event of this tie, I die and raitaki lives. Please don't let this happen :)



None.

Aug 12 2013, 10:19 pm Fire_Kame Post #202

wth is starcraft

Uh no...that relates to the mafia hit vote at night. Double lynches are possible.




Aug 12 2013, 10:23 pm Leeroy_Jenkins Post #203



I see.

Well, gg.



None.

Aug 14 2013, 4:52 am Fire_Kame Post #204

wth is starcraft

Due to the same technical difficulties, I don't have access to any of my game notes. However, I'd like to end the game with a

TOWN VICTORY.

When really it should be called...like...total annihilation victory, because Azrael was the only one left and he was the detective.

Full notes and final day post will be forth coming, but without access to my game notes I can't quite summarize the game I want to yet. It will be a couple weeks at least before I'll have access to them, so I want to end the game so that the next host - if there is one - can get underway with their hosting thing.

Detective: Azrael

Mafia: Zycorax, Sacrieur, Raitaki, and Farty.

Thank you for playing mafia.

The one thing I will sy about this is that I will not host a game with an invincible detective again, and will add the nurse role back into the game.




Aug 14 2013, 5:39 am Positively Post #205



YAY. Good game.
Az how did you know who was Mafia?



None.

Aug 14 2013, 5:44 am lil-Inferno Post #206

Just here for the pie

Quote from Positively
Az how did you know who was Mafia?
Probably because he was the detective.




Aug 14 2013, 2:47 pm Roy Post #207

An artist's depiction of an Extended Unit Death

Question for the mafia team: what was your strategy to eliminate the Detective? Did any of you attempt a covert counter-claim?




Aug 14 2013, 2:48 pm Positively Post #208



Quote from lil-Inferno
Quote from Positively
Az how did you know who was Mafia?
Probably because he was the detective.

Oh... obviously, thanks.



None.

Aug 14 2013, 3:04 pm Raitaki Post #209



Well, we were planning to counterclaim on like Day 3, but then I missed that whole day and none of the others got around to do it, and afterwards I felt it was too late to counterclaim without being really suspicious, soooo

Well we did manage to slip by the radar for quite a while though \o/ For like the last half of the game the town outnumbered us by only one so we were hoping for someone to be inactive and/or not use their vote so we can quickwagon for double lynch, buuuut >_>



None.

Aug 14 2013, 3:05 pm Sacrieur Post #210

Still Napping

Quote from Roy
Question for the mafia team: what was your strategy to eliminate the Detective? Did any of you attempt a covert counter-claim?

There was no attempt, but I had quite a few plans.

I really quarter-assed it until around halfway through, then half-assed it the rest of the time.

---

The rest of mafia really weren't active enough to take action on much.



None.

Aug 14 2013, 4:13 pm jjf28 Post #211

Cartography Artisan

how did lil 'know' az was the detective, seems irresponsible to assure the rest of the town that without having some sort of evidence beyond his word



TheNitesWhoSay - Clan Aura - github

Reached the top of StarCraft theory crafting 2:12 AM CST, August 2nd, 2014.

Aug 14 2013, 4:42 pm Azrael Post #212



I guess I'll have to explain what happened.

These were my investigations.

Night 1: Aristocrat
Night 2: rayNimagi
Night 3: Leeroy_Jenkins
Night 4: Generalpie
Night 5: Sacrieur
Night 6: Azrael
Night 7: Azrael

For most of the game, the idea was to investigate people unlikely to be hit, while lynching people who weren't being active to eliminate any inactive Mafia and reducing the suspect pool. I also tried to find Townies via behavioral analysis and have them help me publicly, such as lil-Inferno and Roy. It was to make it seem as though I'd already investigated them, to divert Mafia hits away from people I'd actually investigated.

After investigating each person, I asked them to go inactive and stop voting to reduce the odds of Mafia targeting them, while simultaneously making a campaign out of lynching inactive players.

Quote from Positively
Az how did you know who was Mafia?

Mainly process of elimination. There were 6 other players left, and 3 of them were confirmed Town; at that point the confirmed players outnumbered the unconfirmed players, so it made sense to wipe out the minority side, especially after an investigation of Sacrieur showed he was Mafia.

Things that could be done better if hosted in the future:

1) The Detective should not have received a unique Detective PM. Having Inferno post that in the thread was the beginning of my rise to power. It was specifically stated by a few people leading up to the game (and before/during the previous game) that Detective shouldn't be able to confirm himself via role PM. That defeats the purpose of Mafia and Detective being indistinguishable from one another. What should have happened is, 15 generic Townie PMs were written and randomly distributed to the 15 players. The Mafia and Detective have a second paragraph added, which simply states "You are actually Mafia/Detective" (and Mafia have their teammates written there as well, of course).

2) Players should never be named in day/night posts unless they died. My identity was confirmed in the posts when I was shot, as it not only stated someone was shot who survived (indicating a Detective had been shot, which was already too much information), but it also stated that I was the one who got shot. It was mentioned in multiple posts, that I was recovering from my gunshot wound, starting from the night I was actually shot. At this point a counterclaim would have been impossible for Mafia. Players shouldn't be able to tell the difference between Mafia hitting Detective and Mafia abstaining their kill, never mind knowing who the Detective was that got shot.

Although the main faults in this game were with the players; half the people playing were inactive, and Mafia never did anything except pretend to be Townies 100% of the time. Due to the inactivity issue, there were a few points in the game where Mafia could have matched the Town's vote and lynched me; on the day DevliN was lynched, for example, they could have performed a double lynch which included me. And that's assuming they didn't get a single Townie to help them. All in all, I was fairly disappointed with the Town's lack of interest in playing, and the amount of inactivity basically turned the game into "kill off the people who aren't playing and hope some of them are Mafia".

Thanks to the Town members who ended up being active every day, especially rayNimagi, Leeroy, and Generalpie. If any of them had been inactive for an entire cycle from the point the lynch against Sacrieur started, the Town would have lost.

Also, please post the link from the role generator, to verify that role distribution was done legitimately.

Quote from jjf28
how did lil 'know' az was the detective, seems irresponsible to assure the rest of the town that without having some sort of evidence beyond his word

Not taking my behavior and interactions with him into account, he had a pretty good idea I was Detective when I was able to produce that super-Detectivish role PM as soon as role distribution was done. I didn't have a generic Townie PM to use even if I wanted to.




Aug 14 2013, 6:07 pm Raitaki Post #213



Well I guess I should start getting my game on the road :hurr:

If y'all have no objections to the DEFCON setup I posted in the Mafia Hosting Order thread and don't need some time to take a break, I'll start to prepare it and get the thread up in a few days.



None.

Aug 14 2013, 8:04 pm Fire_Kame Post #214

wth is starcraft

I knew you'd have something to say...

Quote from Azrael
Quote from Positively
Az how did you know who was Mafia?

Mainly process of elimination. There were 6 other players left, and 3 of them were confirmed Town; at that point the confirmed players outnumbered the unconfirmed players, so it made sense to wipe out the minority side, especially after an investigation of Sacrieur showed he was Mafia.

Things that could be done better if hosted in the future:

1) The Detective should not have received a unique Detective PM. Having Inferno post that in the thread was the beginning of my rise to power. It was specifically stated by a few people leading up to the game (and before/during the previous game) that Detective shouldn't be able to confirm himself via role PM. That defeats the purpose of Mafia and Detective being indistinguishable from one another. What should have happened is, 15 generic Townie PMs were written and randomly distributed to the 15 players. The Mafia and Detective have a second paragraph added, which simply states "You are actually Mafia/Detective" (and Mafia have their teammates written there as well, of course).

This also could be counter balanced by not having an invincible detective - it would cause the detective to not want to claim straight out. In past games depending on who the nurse is they will be hesitant to believe that the first person to claim is in fact the detective. In fact, I've seen some detectives die as a result of this, or because the nurse inactive, etc.

You also knew lil was a townie because less than a minute after I sent out Role PMs he sent his to you over skype.

Quote
2) Players should never be named in day/night posts unless they died. My identity was confirmed in the posts when I was shot, as it not only stated someone was shot who survived (indicating a Detective had been shot, which was already too much information), but it also stated that I was the one who got shot. It was mentioned in multiple posts, that I was recovering from my gunshot wound, starting from the night I was actually shot. At this point a counterclaim would have been impossible for Mafia. Players shouldn't be able to tell the difference between Mafia hitting Detective and Mafia abstaining their kill, never mind knowing who the Detective was that got shot.

Like the opening post said, there were no clues in the posts. I'm sorry if you interpreted there to be clues in these posts, but there was not. You were "shot" to add color to the story. Later in the story many people were injured that were also players (such as Sacrieur ending up in the hospital). You getting shot was more of a jab at you as you were acting high and mighty in the skype chat, and I had threatened that I would strike you down with lightening. There were no clues in the posts, and I have not been led to believe that anyone other than you read so much into them...it was very little more than post color.

Quote
Although the main faults in this game were with the players; half the people playing were inactive, and Mafia never did anything except pretend to be Townies 100% of the time. Due to the inactivity issue, there were a few points in the game where Mafia could have matched the Town's vote and lynched me; on the day DevliN was lynched, for example, they could have performed a double lynch which included me. And that's assuming they didn't get a single Townie to help them. All in all, I was fairly disappointed with the Town's lack of interest in playing, and the amount of inactivity basically turned the game into "kill off the people who aren't playing and hope some of them are Mafia".

Actually, I would rather believe that it was the invincible detective that caused this game to be a war of attrition. You claimed early on (via lil as proxy for a while) as detective, and as such people did not require any more proof. If there had been a nurse role, perhaps you would not have been so eager to claim. I also can appreciate the nurse role because it is their job to make sure the town survives, not just the detective. They have their own behavioral analysis to do, because it isn't about who is mafia for them, its about who is mafia going to hit next. As long as the detective keeps their head down during the game and strategizes quietly, the nurse can be a very powerful determining factor.

You knew you could be reckless and get away with it because the town's strongest role would always survive. I don't like that - it strongly diminishes the playability of being a townie. It became little more than trench warfare.

Quote
Thanks to the Town members who ended up being active every day, especially rayNimagi, Leeroy, and Generalpie. If any of them had been inactive for an entire cycle from the point the lynch against Sacrieur started, the Town would have lost.

Also, please post the link from the role generator, to verify that role distribution was done legitimately.
There's a link? Let me look for it. I assumed it would've sent me to a dead link, so it looks like it is lost. I took a screenshot after the roles were generated, but unfortunately it is on the computer with all my other mafia information. So that will have to wait. Maybe there's a moderator who can see the link.

Either way, if it had been done illegitimately, I would've made sure you weren't detective. Since invincible detective was your idea, you'd be the one that'd be best able to game the system. I would rather have preferred anyone but you to have been a detective. I almost rerolled stats right there.

Quote
Quote from jjf28
how did lil 'know' az was the detective, seems irresponsible to assure the rest of the town that without having some sort of evidence beyond his word

Not taking my behavior and interactions with him into account, he had a pretty good idea I was Detective when I was able to produce that super-Detectivish role PM as soon as role distribution was done. I didn't have a generic Townie PM to use even if I wanted to.

And also he sent you his role pm within the first minute, probably knowing that if you were mafia and killed him that's fine, because town wouldn't have stood a chance, but if you were a townie then you two could start forming an alliance (with the hope that the others in the chat were either also townies or else would not notice the post).

I'd also like to add that I think the greatest problem SEN has with mafia games is that there is to large of a difference between player ability. It is really frustrating that even though (as demon constantly reminds me) these rules were really simple compared to other versions of mafia, there was a lot of misunderstanding about rules throughout the game. There were some players that could dedicate more time to the game than others, even though this is a rather low maintenance game. Azrael having come up with - or at least played a significant role in developing - the invincible detective method knew best how to use it. Being Azrael, people followed him unquestionably because of his track record, which could have ended miserably if he had been mafia fake claiming.

There were two things that the mafia did that made me cringe.

First off Raitaki, why didn't you lynch Azrael on the last day? At the very least then only Leeroy would be standing instead of the detective.

Second, Sacrieur might have been able to pull off a fake claim on Azrael when he was put on the chopping block. He could've claimed that Azrael was mafia (as was he) and that at the very least the town should double lynch. He could name a largely inactive townie that got lynched - such as DevliN - as being the real detective and accused Azrael of being greedy and feeling that if they mafia didn't lose someone soon the town would catch on. He could site how readily Azrael knew the outcome of night hits (things such as when the mafia did not make a successful hit, Azrael told everyone to not vote on account of it'll further cement the town's trust). Even if it hadn't worked, at that point it would've led for a much more interesting end.




Aug 14 2013, 8:23 pm Wing Zero Post #215

Magic box god; Suck it Corbo

Quote from Fire_Kame
Mafia: Zycorax, Sacrieur, Raitaki, and Farty.

Quote from Fire_Kame
Mafia: Raitaki

Quote from Fire_Kame
Raitaki

I friggin called it!




Aug 14 2013, 8:27 pm Fire_Kame Post #216

wth is starcraft

If you had backed it up with some sort of proof maybe people would've listened.

But again...see my notes on invincible detective.




Aug 14 2013, 8:39 pm Raitaki Post #217



@Kame: Why does it matter? I'd have lost either way :P Anyway, I started out voting Leeroy since voting Azrael would make it obvious I was mafia in case Az still somehow didn't know, then I just sat back and waited to see if something happens and suddenly ORZ THE DEADLINE WAS 5 HOURS AGO



None.

Aug 14 2013, 9:00 pm Fire_Kame Post #218

wth is starcraft

From what I understand, right before Sac died he confirmed who the rest of the mafia were. :P




Aug 14 2013, 9:17 pm Dem0n Post #219

ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ

So who's hosting next? :awesome:




Aug 14 2013, 9:21 pm lil-Inferno Post #220

Just here for the pie

Quote from Dem0n
So who's hosting next? :awesome:
Raitaki. I'd like to host after him, but I make no guarantees that I will/can when the time comes.




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