Why do you specify that a higher power should guide your actions? Reminds me of people who say that God guides their every action and believe that God sends sinners to hell - obviously all sinners are punished for doing something they did not have control of.

The bible says that God doesn't want robots, he doesn't want people to be forced to follow him or have to have it pushed right infront of their eyes, Christianity is based on faith, you have to have faith to a certain extent. Even if you have witnessed a miracle or something else to make you beleive. If you truly beleive, you have faith. And there is some proof, or at least support to Christianity. If you Google the Dead Sea Scrolls, which were scrolls that are from thousands of years ago that match the bible almost perfectly, you might be interested.

When do you think the bible was written? ;o As far as I know, those scrolls come from some Christian sect that hung out in caves.

They scientifically dated the scrolls to back when the bible was first written, before it was fully put together. They did that thing where they take a piece of it, then burn it for the gas stuff.


What about tons of medical breakthroughs that were thought otherwise impossible, or airplanes? In the medevil times do you think people thought they would someday be flying in the sky via giant metal thing? If you told them they'd probably say it was impossible or trickery.

@Dev.

First of all, just because God doesn't save every street bum, doesn't mean he doesn't exist. There are TONS of christian missonarys and homeless food shelters and soup kitchens, TONS of oversears missonarys helping people with everyday problems such as food and construction, as well as teaching them the bible. If God saved everyone, there would be overpopulation and no punishment on earth for bad deeds, people could get away with anything they wanted, If God made a perfect world for this, He'd have succeeded in creating robots to do everything correctly, thus being bored.

Athiest. We exist because existance dxists. Those who say God made the universe are saying God exists outside of existance. Which is sounding pretty darn silly to me... How could anything exist outside of our existance. Alternatively an Alien could of created Earth and placed us on here and granted 'miracles' and made us appear the same... But what created the alien that could of created us? Ultimatly religion is absurd and those who follow it should be open to equally absurd things...

Then how did things come to existance? How were the components of the big bang theory created? By your terms, something has to start from somewhere.

I don't find most counter-Christianity statements valid because they don't even know half the things they are talking about and they talk without even reading the Bible.

I don't believe in God because I just don't see any reason to. It's as simple as that. But I understand that I'm not going to change anyone's mind, and noone's going to change my mind about it, so I tend to stay away from these types of debates.

Echo you have no idea what you're talking about. I am saying we exist because we exist. God cannot of came before existance. I don't have to solve some form of equation to prove God's non-existance since God himself is not an equation. God and all concepts of God are a belief, it's psychological not scientifical so the abcense of proof is due to the ultimate factor that you have to use logic not figures. And the belief that God could of created existance and all that dwells within it before himself being..

. created is illogical. (someone fix this to one post... damn char limit...)

I just can't wait until we find and retrieve actual microorganisms(that should be there) under the permafrost on mars. That will finally close the book on the bible.
Wrong question. We already know that matter/energy can not be created or destroyed and could easily have always existed. Anything with the properties: 1)Can not be created 2) can not be destroyed, you can reason has always existed. The real question is what made it go 'bang'. I think what you meant to bring up was the cosmological argument of there having to be a prime mover.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Feb 4 2009, 6:00 pm by ClansAreForGays.

If it always existed how is it hard to beleive that God always existed? Something had to create them. Things don't appear, they have a reason for being created.


You know, This guy got in a car accident. From all the metal that flew everywhere, a watch appeared perfectly working on his wrist, sounds pretty absurd huh?

Devilesk used to have a great signature based on this point. You're saying that God always existing and creating the universe makes more sense than the universe just existing. Apply Occam's razor.

Also, your sig doesn't really make sense. If you're wrong, there's more than one possibility. There could be a hell designed strictly for Christians, and you just don't know it ;o In addition, Christianity doesn't preach that all Christians will go to heaven, or that all non-Christians will go to hell. That kind of conceited attitude isn't going to get you very far in the eyes of the Lord ;o

EDIT: Found the pic.



Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Feb 4 2009, 7:49 pm by Killer_Kow.

Shocko, I do know what I'm talking about because I am Christian, I go to school, and I also try to study Christianity in my spare time.

And you're saying matter/energy cannot be created or destroyed. I can say God cannot be created or destroyed. In the Bible, it said that God was the word and the word created heavens and earth, etc. This is exactly why arguements against one another is invalid. Do you see where I'm coming here?

Why did you quote all three of us (and it a very particular manner) when you only responded to shocko?

I responded to you in the second and Killer_Kow's was alike in some ways.

I also find the concept of it all to be strange. Devote your life worshipping what could of been a hoax that never was revealed to be a joke and finding nothing out because there is no afterlife or consequently I am doomed to eternal pain. God sounds swell... i'm going to read a book made by people much less primative, with obviously less understanding of the world then our modern society!! How reliable and definite!

I can say the same thing. Going by something that someone else says instead of researching and actually knowing what it is about, claiming to know such a thing and being ignorant about it. Yet can't even really counter arguements and make sense of how matter just exists. How reliable and definite!

To summarize my point, there is no point in trying to prove one thing or another in the topic of religion vs science.

Personally I find it very hard to believe because apparently God has a great plan, so what good would my opposing faith have to do with his plan(insertquestionmarkherebecausemykeyboardsbeinggay)

likewise with your side. You are ignorant to the fact that you could be wrong. The Bible and all religous books are too convenient... God wont prove himself because he has nothing to prove, yet Jesus was sent to die on the cross for sins thousands of years ago... as if to say ous r society is much less sinful and not in need of another miracle worker...

i'm doing religion versus logic... not science and i already explained why...