Lately I've been reviewing text-based menu systems. I was rather impressed by The Architect by Oh_Man who has posted a video showing a complex dropship menu system which can be used for all kinds of cool gameplay dynamics.
Whilst in theory it sounds awesome, I'm wondering of the actual practibility of such a system, considering: 1. A large part of the game will be spent in the menu system, and players won't be able to talk to each other. Could be annoying. 2. This system may be too complex, confusing, or even intolerable for the average player.
BENEFITS
Gameplay interactivity all under one system
Allows for limitless items without using units
Lots of information can be stored
Can perform complex commands
DRAWBACKS
Players can't talk during menu operation
Can be confusing
Chews up gameplay time
Trigger heavy
So the question is, will it work? Will players like such a system or is the system too complex and too annoying?
Yeah it works. You can use binary countoffs to transfer counts from one DC to another which are triggered by actions in the menu. You can detect what "button" a player presses by various types of held items by workers. They way I set it up is I made four probes and four drones hold four different types of things. Then, I can detect each one uniquely when they exit the dropship.
So the trick for triggering it really is just to get familiar with binary countoffs to perform count transfers, multiplication and division.
Yeah it works. You can use binary countoffs to transfer counts from one DC to another which are triggered by actions in the menu. You can detect what "button" a player presses by various types of held items by workers. They way I set it up is I made four probes and four drones hold four different types of things. Then, I can detect each one uniquely when they exit the dropship.
So the trick for triggering it really is just to get familiar with binary countoffs to perform count transfers, multiplication and division.
I'm not asking for trigger advice. I'm asking whether or not this system will simply be 'liked' from a gameplay perspective by the average player. If you refer to my two numbered points in my original post, you can see the dilemma.
I played his map, it worked really well. I didn't have trouble talking since it only refreshes the menu text when it disappears.
This is potentially problematic for two reasons. 1. If the text isn't refreshed and the player is still using the menu, this will be confusing. 2. If a player is trying to read the menu and other players are typing, it will delete the top lines of the text message (assuming it's reached the full 11 lines).
...By the way, how did you guys find the spell system The Architect? Not too confusing?
I'm not asking for trigger advice. I'm asking whether or not this system will simply be 'liked' from a gameplay perspective by the average player. If you refer to my two numbered points in my original post, you can see the dilemma.
Er, I tried to say "of course it works" as in you can play a game with it. I've played multiple maps. So then the rest of my post is explaining that given that the system works from a gameplay perspective it becomes merely a matter of implementation. And since you listed "trigger heavy" as a drawback, I talked about that. No need to be so defensive.
Whilst in theory it sounds awesome, I'm wondering of the actual practibility of such a system, considering: 1. A large part of the game will be spent in the menu system, and players won't be able to talk to each other. Could be annoying. 2. This system may be too complex, confusing, or even intolerable for the average player.
1. Definitely a system for a single player game. The best compromise I've seen is to display the text in intervals of time to allow players to message each other. This however is pretty tedious and not a perfect solution. 2. It can be very simple if presented in a simple fashion. You have to design the use of the carrier in a way that makes sense for gameplay. For example, having each button in the carrier correspond to a specific spell won't make much sense if you use two types of workers, as memorizing what slot does what can be difficult. If you however attempt to make it clear what button does what (perhaps like Fwop_'s) by laying out the button locations next to iconic units.
2. If a player is trying to read the menu and other players are typing, it will delete the top lines of the text message (assuming it's reached the full 11 lines).
Oh well. It'll refresh in a few seconds. It's not a big deal unless someone's purposely spamming, in which case you can squelch them.
When I used this system in his map, I found that it worked exceptionally well from a player's perspective. It's intuitive, functional, and stylish. I spent considerable time sitting in town browsing the menus, and it was really implemented well. I carried on a conversation with him at the same time without any problems.
The only real potential issues I see are those that affect the mapmaker (string limits, for example). Otherwise, from just the perspective of a player, it's a very effective system.
Both use the shuttle menu system. I can't seem to find Lost Souls anywhere on SEN DLDB. Maybe Cecil should put it up? (Damn you Cecil for not finishing that map!)
HOW SPELLS WORK
First you unlock the spell by levelling up:
Then you view the spellbook in the Journal:
Then you assign the spell to the hotkey of your choice:
Then you cast the spell using the hotkey you chose:
Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Dec 10 2012, 6:15 pm by Oh_Man.
By the way, I'm wondering how in Cataclysm the dropship menu system works? Somehow it is able to distinguish between the same unit type (as in 4 Probes and 4 SCVs). In other words, how do you determine which Probe is being dropped? Below is a screenshot of what I'm referring to...
By the way, I'm wondering how in Cataclysm the dropship menu system works? Somehow it is able to distinguish between the same unit type (as in 4 Probes and 4 SCVs). In other words, how do you determine which Probe is being dropped? Below is a screenshot of what I'm referring to...
I tried explaining it here. If you look at the corner of the Cataclysm map you can see the workers next to things to hold. You can see clearly in my Lost Souls RPG map how it works.
Find Me On Discord (Brood War UMS Community & Staredit Network)
You detect the probe and scv AND the powerups. 1. Probe Mineral Chunk 1 2. Probe Mineral Chunk 2 3. Probe Vespene Gas 1 4. Probe Vespene Gas 2 5. SCV Mineral Chunk 1 6. SCV Mineral Chunk 2 7. SCV Vespene Gas 1 8. SCV Vespene Gas 2
For complex systems, text based menus are a very viable option. In multiplayer maps you can use the leaderboard (if it's free) to show whether a player is in menu or not. That or some other method should help alleviate the communication problems.
Lethal and I used an extensive text-based system in Nightfall a few years ago. I've uploaded a video of it (and a little extra): The items were represented by units but interacted with textually. When the Menu is brought up, the items are removed so that they don't cause any interference with the clicking. The menu was not at all complete (e.g. database was functional but empty). For the record, Nightfall didn't use EUDs in any way.
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