Ok I got two other things.

1. There's a glitch where there is no victory, even if the other teams heroes are killed. I thnk it's linked to defilers.

2. The timer also is not set even with game seconds. I started to capture a base when the timer said 9:00, and it wasn't done when a ok interrupted it at 8:20. This messes ppl up who don't run out to stall, ect.

1. This "glitch" is intentoinal. The version you played was likely a test version that you could play single player. It has nothing to do with defilers.

2. The timer doesn't use the time showed on the top as a counter. It uses DCs that run for approximately 30 seconds.

1. No. The glitch is that the defiled counters stay for the player, and the game doesn't end. You can still win If you kill the other temple tho. I've also seen it happen multiple times in both 1.5 and 1.4.

2. Yes, I understand that. I'm just saying it would be good if they lined up, so timing would be easier.

1. xYoshix Is correct.
2. You are correct. It doesn't fit exactly.. I never bothered to see if it did... because one'd assume 12 dc = 1 game second (altho in SC, 1 game second is faster than 1 second in the real world)

The trigger cycle to second conversion is based off real life seconds, not game seconds.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on May 6 2009, 8:43 pm by Mini Moose 2707.

Hi guys. I’ve been neglecting Temple Siege for quite a while now, and I have to say, I’ll probably be neglecting even more of it. The reason being that I have full-time work and I’m taking a course tues – thurs every week… The only possible day in which I can do anything with the map is Saturday and Sunday.

Nevertheless, I have finally crystallized my thoughts and decided on what I will do for the final leg of v1.5 (it’s been so long I might as well call it v1.6 ). In fact, I was planning to revamp all the heroes by adding a combo spell for each of them. But I decided against it in the end, because several heroes are intrinsically great with just these four spells (i.e. Assassin, Mutant). So I will only revamp a few heroes.. play them.. balance them.. and release the map.

DARK MAGE
The DM is not a popular hero due to the linearity and inflexibility of its spell, not to mention that most people literally depend on its L4 to win.
So the following spell changes will get the DM to use its strength more with the new summoning spell. I have also changed her L3’s focus into destroying spawns rather than irritating heroes (this can be swapped between L2 and L3, although I like L2’s focus on PvP)
L1 – Summon Dark Orb – same
L1 with DA out – Summon Disciples
– Destroys DA to create four Broodlings. Any spell effects like paralysis when the DA explodes is under consideration, possibilities include Teleporting + spawn broodlings, Drain mana + spawn broodlings, Stun + Spawn broodlings, or Kill Spawns + Spawn broodlings.
L2 – Curse of Weakness
– same, except Cursed Heroes’ summons will be stunned to p12 (DA and Phantoms will be killed)
L3 – Curse of Agony
– All p7/p8 Biological spawns (anything but battletank and goliath) will be stunned and set to 10-20% HP.
- Will only affect heroes for 15-20 seconds.
L4 – Curse of the Swarm
- Same except all enemy spawns near you will die and also become your broodlings.
Stats: The DM will probably be set to 4200-4500 HP and may suffer a decrease in damage up from 35+5 to 35+4 damage.

PSION
Psion has been very UnderPowered in terms of getting kills, so an semi-offensive spell has been thought up. I also wish to put in the old Banish idea… but that may result in the removal of Vortex.
L1 – Void – same
L1 – when Void is out – Void Rift
- Summons 1 immobile + invincible dragoon for 10 seconds. Whether the dragoon will be affected by spells is in consideration.
L2 – Negative Field – same
L3 – Either stay the same with Vortex or Switch to:
- Dimension Cleft – Removes spawns and Banishes players to an alternate dimension, disabling them and moving them out of play for 30 seconds.
L4 – same
*NOTE: Since all spells require the Void to use, the mechanics of the new alternate Spell 1 is currently not comboable with the other two spells…. So I am planning to make it so that the Void is still out when the spells are in play, will not stop/drain mana, and be removed at the end of the spells. This way, I’ll make it possible to use L1 and then L2 or L3. But NOT L2 or L3 then L1… or L2 then L3.

Engineer and Assault
Engineer will get max 2 sci-ves, and may have its HP back up to 4800 HP, so it will act as a good Defensive Hero. It’s damage will be 24+4
Assault’s L1 will be getting a 1.5 sensor time requirement (needs to be above an enemy for 1.5 seconds to blow) and spawns 3 wraiths that shoots once.
It’s HP and attack will either be 4000, 11+3, or 4500, 16+2… I’m leaning towards the first one. I have also been thinking about the FlashBang spell, but will probably settle for what it is right now.
Also, it will not be able to spawn max 2 ghosts, which cannot cloak, doing 50+7 damage (due to phantom).

Summoner and Archer
With the new changes w/the spawn leader, the summoner is heavily underpowered early game. And for the archer, not enough people think its L3 is a good enough spell to use.
What I’m gonna do is make it so that when you have zero summons out in the arena, you have the ability to summon 2-3 of the zlings/companions. A cooldown will be implemented for this effect. For example, if you have 0 zlings out in the arena, and you haven’t summoned anything for 15-30 seconds, you will spawn 2-3 zlings instead of one. Same goes for the companions.
With this, the summoner’s zling cap will be brought back to 9, and the summoner’s stats (which I have changed recently) will return back to normal (except Consume will require 0 E)

Things/Ideas from Moose and Things to Fix.
These are the things that I will fix in the next version…
- P12 Aldaris are now removed. (L1 + leave game = WALL OF LIGHT!)
- Removed L1 energy abuse bug. (Note: This ended up as "spawn with 60-something energy" somehow. Fix next version.)
- You can now level up while disabled.
- Death messages for disabled players are no longer delayed.
- Disable is now removed upon death.
- Charge of Courage (L3) now destroys player summons of the other team.
- P12 Scourge resulting from Volt's L1 in combination with other spells are now removed.
- P12 Science Vessels are now removed.
- Fix Mutant becoming Earth Demon at elimination

And of course, new terrain by MNeox and xYoshix .. which still have a few problems currently *whips xYoshix*

Along with these changes, could you also fix the mission objectives? Mech's, for example, still says his l4 is the one in 1.4.

Ow!!! Okay, Okay! I'll get right on to it

Oh, and I found this flaw. Appearantly, you can meld two dts from the spell area into a DA, and Assasin's s4 doesn't work when spammed.

Edit: Post was way too long have modified quotes to help it not be as lenghty.

i love all these changes. The mana drain was annoying but the slow was nice.

Also i can't remember if it was a specific spell or all the curses that had a cannot create unit when the phantom used phantom shot. Might be something to consider on removing if you can.

The goon sounds great to me. Good double shot imo. Also one Little comment not sure if its good or bad but the spell 1 for void removes allied spawn if the spawn passes through when its being cast. There's really no way arround this though that i can think of.

I vote L3 stays as is. The removal is just too powerful. It sounds good but if you remove a hero from the map its worse than disabling them because they won't be able to help anything. You could essentially remove them when they cast a spell or when your planning an assult on something. If it was implemented There would need to be restrictions to keep it from removing more than 1 hero and a cooldown of some sort to keep it from being used indefinately.

Had a very annoying run in with sci vessels so i'm glad to see the change.

The spell 3 for fbat seems to be overpowered at 30mins for refinery with 70 armor. I've been able to sim the entire map against some hero configerations and with good allies i can protect them well from nearly any configuration. It pretty much
tips the game. Would like to see this go back to 35mins and if possible an increse in building kill score for punishment for losing them. 5 more or less armor might be considerable also depending on how its changed if you do change it.

Assult L1 i assume will go off as normal if the max time limit expires? Also are you planning any kind of increased stun at all or will you leave this the same as it currently is?

As for its dmg I really do not like what i see from the +3 but increasing the hp back has problems as well both of which seem to lead to a basic hp rine build which is quite horrible. I honestly don't know which to pick.

I actually see the hydras much more than i use to. I've been seeing them even more than the L1 spam and all i play pretty much is temple siege because it is so competive and i prefer strategy games.

L2 also seems to be a bit more common that it formerly was and i've seen good use made of it too. I will start to think of a use for the extractor which would be a nice compliment to the Fbat's refinery.

the cooldown on the multiple summon is what i'm concerned about the most here. You can still cast normally if you have the mana correct? I'm Hopping so.

I assume you've fixed the other bugs that i've said such as the l3 from lurking keeping hydras alive. only brought this up because it was mentioned near the time of the earth demon bug. I believe this is a bit more complex and thus why it hasn't been fixed.

also new bug or one i have seen is ling casting l3 and then l2 allows him to cast the lurker's stun mine spell. Also, I honestly can't remember if the rine vulture bug has been brought up but it works just like the ling's lurk spell. The Rine gets 4 vultures and can't cast spells but it only occurs now after he dies his final death and the dropship is still out.

*Edit* another bug was just shown by friend. Can fly a sci vessel to bottom and irrad the units there for tons of exp.

would really really like a sample of the newest version please Idk if your affraid it will leak and thus are only giving to testers you've played with or what.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on May 7 2009, 3:16 am by killer_sss.

ok what exactly do you mean by this? please explain more. Is bottom bottom of the map or bottom base or bottom warp gate?

Also, thx unholy for using the psion's double l1 idea, i think it'll give him more of an edge early game since right now he kinda sux early game.

Also, i like the idea for the summons for summoner, but i dont exactly agree for archer's companions. If you give a summoner 2 extra lings, its the equivalent of 50 gas, but if you give the archer 2 extra companions, thats the equivalent of 160 gas, more than a free l4.

Also, you calling the engineer a defensive hero is kinda untrue. His l4 does way too much dmg to be considered defensive, and basically shuts down every other hero, especially with the new medic l4, except volt and mech's l2. It would be good if you maybe put a cap on the amount of mines the engineer could have out on the field at one time. Maybe set it to 100? This would also stop the massive unit lag that is often associated with an engineer with high mana and l4.

I also like the new dm spells, it helps him to have a little more of an advantage against opponents who would normally completely shut him down.


what is this flashbang spell? i've never heard of it b4 on the forums, but it sounds cool.

I would also like to sample the new v. It seems really cool and might make ppl start playing 1.5 more, since it seems like nobody plays it lately.

I'm glad that you guys like the ideas.

The FB's Refinery now has 50 armor.
I don't understand what you meant by your worries of the summons... basically if all your summons died (zling/hydras), so you have none out in the field, and you have had a cooldown for a long time, you will summon an extra unit or two.
For the summoner, this'd make it have more defense. If his zlings all died, he will be able to spawn xtra lings.. but if THOSE lings died right away, then the summoner has to run for the cooldown to take effect.
If the summoner has even one zling out in the field at the moment, it will not spawn extra lings. It is a purely defensive thing.

I am planning so that the cooldown is
- 15-29 secs = 2 lings.. >30 secs = 3 lings.
- >30 secs = 2 hydras.

Flashbang is sort of moose's idea (but i had the idea a long time ago.. ) It's basically Tear gas, except the D-web goes away, the mana drainage is instant, and you get slowed down for 10 seconds wherever you go (not just under the web)... it's basically Tear Gas, but instant.

Alas, the post simply states Proposed ideas... none of them has been done yet <.<.. As I said, it'd take me a long time for now, since i'm working and taking a course at the same time. The newest ver simply has a fixed medic and a comboable LM. .. and the newest terrain isn't done yet XD (Blame xYoshix now!)

Comboable LM? It always has been comboable.

basically what i'm concerned about with the summoner is that if the cooldown is in effect he can't summon normally at like 1 ling per because this would really mess him up.

as for the irradiate bug at the bottom of the map is a bunch of cliffs out of the game arena with units that contiuasly respawn and net hug exp. One can simply fly down there and irradiate and gain exp faster than he could splahsing units.


i'd luv to see you shut down a ling with lurk bombs or grrr h/o will edit this later must run atm to pick up mom emergency!

I'm guessing that he means you no longer lose mana for a poorly timed cast of L1... I'm not sure how I feel about that, if it's autocasting with perfect timing for you.

Gee, leave me alone. It's not easy to make paths have equal lengths I think I'm almost done with it...

No no no.. I thought I posted this... The Lm can now combo L1 with ANY spell at ANY time. This would drastically improve the LM (May have to add more to the LM's L1 cooldown for balancing)... I've also fixed the non-placable reavers... so that it'll move the reavers underneath the LM if it was unplacable at the corner..

=D

Ummmmm.... i dont see how the ling is supposed to just lurk all the mines away without them absolutely wrecking him before he gets close enough.... The only time i've seen a mutaant combat an engineers l4 was when he was RIGHT at his base, and he was under siege. Unless im mistaken and engineer's l4 is no longer mine drone. If thats the case then my bad.

O and also, flashbang seems reeeeeeealy cool. I think moose has alrdy used it in 1.4 tho...

Note: Post moved from 1.4 topic.
Hey, I've also heard a lot of pol complain about psion's l4, since it cloaks him and can recall and stuff in addition to being a base for all his spells. Another idea for it could be that it uses a spell that doesn't allow other players to cast any spells while they're inside it. It might work really well.

Also, with the new spawn system, what I've generally seen with the summoner is not the result you wanted. Basically, depending on who your opponents are, you either get a massive amount of extra exp and still destroy every1 else late-game, or the spawn system and opponents screw you over and you barely get any exp by the time your opponents have l4. One time summoner was literally 300 exp behind everyone else, and not cause he was a noob. He was actually quite good, just that vs. Mech, assault, n psion, he had no chance. The new system also makes games a lot faster and shorter, and the game can turn REALLY fast when someone leaves a lane for like 2 spawn waves.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on May 9 2009, 6:10 pm by Mini Moose 2707.

its not that hard launch lurks b4 you get to the bulk of the mines. uauslly the bulk is near the eenginer and his final placement. Either way all it takes ia about 1000 hp and he can trash more mines than u can put out and his spell cost 80 vs your 120 however many times he casted prolly 240-360 at least if theres a bulk oh and due to his massive exp he can up his armor also thus greatly reducing the dmg. yes the engineer can own him if he out exps the ling early enough but that's pretty hard to do in enough time to stop the ling.

Actually, Mutant is definitely one of the best anti Mine Drone heroes, exceptions being the obvious Volt, Vulture etc. It completely wins when it comes to a spawn battle and just simple Hp+armor upgrades make those mines ultimately weak, not to mention its speed greatly reduce mine damage anyway.

Fix the spawn pathing. I massed goliaths and they all went top path no matter where they were built and no matter where my spawn civ was (inevitably getting completely stuck) . TThis only happens to me while on North, not sure if South has same problem.