[quote=name:Brontobyte][quote=name:devilesk]Which is why position is not an issue.[/quote] Yes, in a perfect world where people live freely and everything goes the way you want it to be. >:( I still say that no matter what skill level, getting to the ball is easier if you are in the center position of the map on either side no matter what. :-_-:[/quote] And yet that's not the argument. There still isn't an imbalance.

Quote from Brontobyte

Quote from (U)devilesk

Which is why position is not an issue.

Yes, in a perfect world where people live freely and everything goes the way you want it to be.

I still say that no matter what skill level, getting to the ball is easier if you are in the center position of the map on either side no matter what.

And yet that's not the argument. There still isn't an imbalance.

[quote=name:devilesk]And yet that's not the argument. There still isn't an imbalance.[/quote] Are you mad? If you agree that someone starting in the middle position [i]does[/i] in fact get to the ball quicker then the people on the outside positions, how is that not an imbalance?

Quote from (U)devilesk

And yet that's not the argument. There still isn't an imbalance.

Are you mad?

If you agree that someone starting in the middle position does in fact get to the ball quicker then the people on the outside positions, how is that not an imbalance?

[quote=name:Brontobyte][quote=name:devilesk]And yet that's not the argument. There still isn't an imbalance.[/quote] Are you mad? If you agree that someone starting in the middle position [i]does[/i] in fact get to the ball quicker then the people on the outside positions, how is that not an imbalance?[/quote] No, I'm not mad. How is it not an imbalance? Why don't you go back and read what I've been posting the entire time and don't reply until you learn why. I'm not repeating myself as this discussion is already going in circles. I've already defeated your arguments. And if you can't see why there isn't an imbalance, then you'll never see. I guess some people will always think there's a flaw in a map when there isn't one.

Quote from Brontobyte

Quote from (U)devilesk

And yet that's not the argument. There still isn't an imbalance.

Are you mad?

If you agree that someone starting in the middle position does in fact get to the ball quicker then the people on the outside positions, how is that not an imbalance?

No, I'm not mad.

How is it not an imbalance? Why don't you go back and read what I've been posting the entire time and don't reply until you learn why. I'm not repeating myself as this discussion is already going in circles. I've already defeated your arguments.

And if you can't see why there isn't an imbalance, then you'll never see. I guess some people will always think there's a flaw in a map when there isn't one.

[quote=name:devilesk]And if you can't see why there isn't an imbalance, then you'll never see. I guess some people will always think there's a flaw in a map when there isn't one.[/quote] I have read every single post that you have typed/re-typed. Getting to the ball quicker is an imbalance. No matter what. You base your "he will have it take from him asap" on the fact that the other team (middle position) is going to be right there to take it from him. Look, all I'm trying to say is that getting to the ball is faster when you travel straight with no turns. I'm sure others would back me up in this as it can simply be [i]proven[/i] by a line. The fastest way to something is in a straight line. Hmm, well lets see, if I have to turn to get to that something, then, oh yeah, its not the fastest way. EDIT: if you can't see why this is correct, then you'll never see.

Quote from (U)devilesk

And if you can't see why there isn't an imbalance, then you'll never see. I guess some people will always think there's a flaw in a map when there isn't one.

I have read every single post that you have typed/re-typed. Getting to the ball quicker is an imbalance. No matter what. You base your "he will have it take from him asap" on the fact that the other team (middle position) is going to be right there to take it from him.

Look, all I'm trying to say is that getting to the ball is faster when you travel straight with no turns. I'm sure others would back me up in this as it can simply be proven by a line. The fastest way to something is in a straight line. Hmm, well lets see, if I have to turn to get to that something, then, oh yeah, its not the fastest way.

EDIT: if you can't see why this is correct, then you'll never see.

[quote=name:Brontobyte][quote=name:devilesk]And if you can't see why there isn't an imbalance, then you'll never see. I guess some people will always think there's a flaw in a map when there isn't one.[/quote] I have read every single post that you have typed/re-typed. Getting to the ball quicker is an imbalance. No matter what. You base your "he will have it take from him asap" on the fact that the other team (middle position) is going to be right there to take it from him. [/quote] Wrong. Go back and read. [quote=name:Brontobyte] Look, all I'm trying to say is that getting to the ball is faster when you travel straight with no turns. I'm sure others would back me up in this as it can simply be [i]proven[/i] by a line. The fastest way to something is in a straight line. Hmm, well lets see, if I have to turn to get to that something, then, oh yeah, its not the fastest way.[/quote] I have already said that you do get to the ball faster from the center. It still doesn't mean there's an imbalance so stop repeating yourself. [quote]EDIT: if you can't see why this is correct, then you'll never see.[/quote] It's not correct.

Quote from Brontobyte

Quote from (U)devilesk

And if you can't see why there isn't an imbalance, then you'll never see. I guess some people will always think there's a flaw in a map when there isn't one.

I have read every single post that you have typed/re-typed. Getting to the ball quicker is an imbalance. No matter what. You base your "he will have it take from him asap" on the fact that the other team (middle position) is going to be right there to take it from him.

Wrong. Go back and read.

Quote from Brontobyte

Look, all I'm trying to say is that getting to the ball is faster when you travel straight with no turns. I'm sure others would back me up in this as it can simply be proven by a line. The fastest way to something is in a straight line. Hmm, well lets see, if I have to turn to get to that something, then, oh yeah, its not the fastest way.

I have already said that you do get to the ball faster from the center. It still doesn't mean there's an imbalance so stop repeating yourself.

Quote

EDIT: if you can't see why this is correct, then you'll never see.

It's not correct.

Brontobyte, just give it up. It really doesn't make that big of a difference. You keep on saying "it's a longer path though!" even after he acknowledges it. As far as the map goes, it's a cool concept, but I just find it just like playing with control of the scourge only I have much less control of it. I'm all for alternate control mechanisms, but this one is actually less effective than normal one, so I really don't find the game that fun, personally. This of course is just a personal preference, and overall I thought it was very well made.. good job on it.

Brontobyte, just give it up. It really doesn't make that big of a difference. You keep on saying "it's a longer path though!" even after he acknowledges it.

As far as the map goes, it's a cool concept, but I just find it just like playing with control of the scourge only I have much less control of it. I'm all for alternate control mechanisms, but this one is actually less effective than normal one, so I really don't find the game that fun, personally. This of course is just a personal preference, and overall I thought it was very well made.. good job on it.

[quote=name:fritfrat(U)]Brontobyte, just give it up. It really doesn't make that big of a difference. You keep on saying "it's a longer path though!" even after he acknowledges it. As far as the map goes, it's a cool concept, but I just find it just like playing with control of the scourge only I have much less control of it. I'm all for alternate control mechanisms, but this one is actually less effective than normal one, so I really don't find the game that fun, personally. This of course is just a personal preference, and overall I thought it was very well made.. good job on it.[/quote] Well it depends on what you mean by "effective". The whole point of the game is the system of control that's been implemented, but you're right that it's a matter of personal preference. I'm just pointing out that it wouldn't be the same game at all if the control was changed. As for well made? Meh, this was just a small side project that took me a day or two to trigger and another few days to polish and release. Also, I've had v1.01 sitting around for a day. I figured out what the problem was with the time options a little after I found out they weren't working. The reason was just that the locations were too small, lol. They only covered the minerals and didn't have enough space so that the chooser could enter them, unlike the locations for the other game options.

Quote from fritfrat(U)

Brontobyte, just give it up. It really doesn't make that big of a difference. You keep on saying "it's a longer path though!" even after he acknowledges it.

As far as the map goes, it's a cool concept, but I just find it just like playing with control of the scourge only I have much less control of it. I'm all for alternate control mechanisms, but this one is actually less effective than normal one, so I really don't find the game that fun, personally. This of course is just a personal preference, and overall I thought it was very well made.. good job on it.

Well it depends on what you mean by "effective". The whole point of the game is the system of control that's been implemented, but you're right that it's a matter of personal preference. I'm just pointing out that it wouldn't be the same game at all if the control was changed. As for well made? Meh, this was just a small side project that took me a day or two to trigger and another few days to polish and release.

Also, I've had v1.01 sitting around for a day. I figured out what the problem was with the time options a little after I found out they weren't working. The reason was just that the locations were too small, lol. They only covered the minerals and didn't have enough space so that the chooser could enter them, unlike the locations for the other game options.

Even if it were easier for a center player to score, you can choose your position in the lobby. If it's 1v1, both players have the option of choosing center. If it's 2v2, both teams can have up to one center player. If it's 3v3, it's totally equal. If it's 1v2 or 2v3 or 1v3, it's already unbalanced to begin with. I haven't been able to play the map, but I tried it in single player and was amazed to find that even though there's a constant "center view" trigger, you can still freely move the cursor. Any idea why? Usually that's not the case in single player.

Even if it were easier for a center player to score, you can choose your position in the lobby. If it's 1v1, both players have the option of choosing center. If it's 2v2, both teams can have up to one center player. If it's 3v3, it's totally equal. If it's 1v2 or 2v3 or 1v3, it's already unbalanced to begin with.

I haven't been able to play the map, but I tried it in single player and was amazed to find that even though there's a constant "center view" trigger, you can still freely move the cursor. Any idea why? Usually that's not the case in single player.

[quote=name:razorsnail]I haven't been able to play the map, but I tried it in single player and was amazed to find that even though there's a constant "center view" trigger, you can still freely move the cursor. Any idea why? Usually that's not the case in single player.[/quote] I think it has something to so with the [i]small[/i] size of the map. I can't see any other reason that this would happen and not move the mouse. I also noticed this. And then after your done selecting how you want to win, points/time, in single player it doesn't move to the top of the game, the center screen keeps on being activated and your screen doesn't move... [quote=name:devilesk]Also, I've had v1.01 sitting around for a day. I figured out what the problem was with the time options a little after I found out they weren't working. The reason was just that the locations were too small, lol. They only covered the minerals and didn't have enough space so that the chooser could enter them, unlike the locations for the other game options.[/quote] Something that you should add in this or a newer version is the fact that you can [i]see[/i] your special effects being created. You should make it a burrowed zerg zergling that is hallucinated. This would make it look cooler. :bye1:

Quote from razorsnail

I haven't been able to play the map, but I tried it in single player and was amazed to find that even though there's a constant "center view" trigger, you can still freely move the cursor. Any idea why? Usually that's not the case in single player.

I think it has something to so with the small size of the map. I can't see any other reason that this would happen and not move the mouse. I also noticed this. And then after your done selecting how you want to win, points/time, in single player it doesn't move to the top of the game, the center screen keeps on being activated and your screen doesn't move...

Quote from (U)devilesk

Also, I've had v1.01 sitting around for a day. I figured out what the problem was with the time options a little after I found out they weren't working. The reason was just that the locations were too small, lol. They only covered the minerals and didn't have enough space so that the chooser could enter them, unlike the locations for the other game options.

Something that you should add in this or a newer version is the fact that you can see your special effects being created. You should make it a burrowed zerg zergling that is hallucinated. This would make it look cooler.

[quote=name:Brontobyte] Something that you should add in this or a newer version is the fact that you can [i]see[/i] your special effects being created. You should make it a burrowed zerg zergling that is hallucinated. This would make it look cooler. :bye1:[/quote] I do that when I want a hallucination death, but I want the corsair death and I don't care if you see the unit being created. That's what happens when you create and kill a unit.

Quote from Brontobyte

Something that you should add in this or a newer version is the fact that you can see your special effects being created. You should make it a burrowed zerg zergling that is hallucinated. This would make it look cooler.

I do that when I want a hallucination death, but I want the corsair death and I don't care if you see the unit being created. That's what happens when you create and kill a unit.

[quote=name:devilesk]That's what happens when you create and kill a unit.[/quote] And you seem to think that I don't know this why? :sly:

Quote from (U)devilesk

That's what happens when you create and kill a unit.

And you seem to think that I don't know this why?

I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?

I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?

Just kicked my brothers ass at this Pretty fun map :D.

Just kicked my brothers ass at this

Pretty fun map .

[quote=name:Impersonation]I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?[/quote] It doesn't use mobile unit grids. What I'm doing is based on the fact that if you center a long location along the edge of a map, its center gets displaced because its edge can only run flush with the edge of the map and can't go past it.

Quote from Impersonation

I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?

It doesn't use mobile unit grids. What I'm doing is based on the fact that if you center a long location along the edge of a map, its center gets displaced because its edge can only run flush with the edge of the map and can't go past it.

[quote=name:devilesk][quote=name:Impersonation]I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?[/quote] It doesn't use mobile unit grids. What I'm doing is based on the fact that if you center a long location along the edge of a map, its center gets displaced because its edge can only run flush with the edge of the map and can't go past it.[/quote] Sorry, I what I meant was to say "coordinate grids." So you center these long locations on the center of the ~Y14 location. This will just place all of the X locations on top of each other and arrange them so that they go something like this" - X1 -- X2 --- X3 ---- X4 ----- X5 ------ X6 just on top of each other. Then how to you find its position and keep it moving in the same direction. I know you use death counts to keep track of which direction the players scourge is going and you click on the eggs to choose that direction. What I don't get is how you keep it moving, and have its location pin pointed. :???:

Quote from (U)devilesk

Quote from Impersonation

I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?

It doesn't use mobile unit grids. What I'm doing is based on the fact that if you center a long location along the edge of a map, its center gets displaced because its edge can only run flush with the edge of the map and can't go past it.

Sorry, I what I meant was to say "coordinate grids." So you center these long locations on the center of the ~Y14 location. This will just place all of the X locations on top of each other and arrange them so that they go something like this"

- X1
-- X2
--- X3
---- X4
----- X5
------ X6

just on top of each other. Then how to you find its position and keep it moving in the same direction. I know you use death counts to keep track of which direction the players scourge is going and you click on the eggs to choose that direction. What I don't get is how you keep it moving, and have its location pin pointed.

[quote=name:Impersonation][quote=name:devilesk][quote=name:Impersonation]I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?[/quote] It doesn't use mobile unit grids. What I'm doing is based on the fact that if you center a long location along the edge of a map, its center gets displaced because its edge can only run flush with the edge of the map and can't go past it.[/quote] Sorry, I what I meant was to say "coordinate grids." So you center these long locations on the center of the ~Y14 location. This will just place all of the X locations on top of each other and arrange them so that they go something like this" - X1 -- X2 --- X3 ---- X4 ----- X5 ------ X6 just on top of each other. Then how to you find its position and keep it moving in the same direction. I know you use death counts to keep track of which direction the players scourge is going and you click on the eggs to choose that direction. What I don't get is how you keep it moving, and have its location pin pointed. :???:[/quote] Well using those locations I can keep track of a unit's X and Y coordinates as well as center a location at any coordinate on the map based on death counters for an X and Y coordinate. So all I need to do is modify the current player's coordinate to get its destination coordinate. For example, if the scourge is at coordinate (x,y), and its going straight up, then I set the y coordinate of it's current position to 0, because that's where the top is. Then I order the scourge to go to that new coordinate. For south I set the y coordinate to the highest y value possible. For west I set the x coordinate to 0, and for east I set the x coordinate to the max. For the ordinals I subtract/add to the x and y coordinate at the same time, until one of them hits a max or min of the grid.

Quote from Impersonation

Quote from (U)devilesk

Quote from Impersonation

I looked at the triggers and the locations and I still am unsure of how you created a unit grid that would move the Zerg Scourge around. I understand some what how it works but could you describe it please?

It doesn't use mobile unit grids. What I'm doing is based on the fact that if you center a long location along the edge of a map, its center gets displaced because its edge can only run flush with the edge of the map and can't go past it.

Sorry, I what I meant was to say "coordinate grids." So you center these long locations on the center of the ~Y14 location. This will just place all of the X locations on top of each other and arrange them so that they go something like this"

- X1
-- X2
--- X3
---- X4
----- X5
------ X6

just on top of each other. Then how to you find its position and keep it moving in the same direction. I know you use death counts to keep track of which direction the players scourge is going and you click on the eggs to choose that direction. What I don't get is how you keep it moving, and have its location pin pointed.

Well using those locations I can keep track of a unit's X and Y coordinates as well as center a location at any coordinate on the map based on death counters for an X and Y coordinate.

So all I need to do is modify the current player's coordinate to get its destination coordinate. For example, if the scourge is at coordinate (x,y), and its going straight up, then I set the y coordinate of it's current position to 0, because that's where the top is. Then I order the scourge to go to that new coordinate. For south I set the y coordinate to the highest y value possible. For west I set the x coordinate to 0, and for east I set the x coordinate to the max. For the ordinals I subtract/add to the x and y coordinate at the same time, until one of them hits a max or min of the grid.

So you center all of the X locations (1-20) over the center of the Y locations (~11-12). Then you simply center the big X location on the Scourge, then find which one of the X (1-20) locations its in. Then you center the Y location in the X location centered on the Scourge? AmIrite? If not, please explain how you did it in more depth. :) [img]http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/3062/eggballgrideu2.png[/img] This is a small mock up of the locations you used and placement. Also, how did you figure out the center of the 20x12 box? I know you used an abnormal location size for your Y locations.

So you center all of the X locations (1-20) over the center of the Y locations (~11-12). Then you simply center the big X location on the Scourge, then find which one of the X (1-20) locations its in. Then you center the Y location in the X location centered on the Scourge? AmIrite? If not, please explain how you did it in more depth.



This is a small mock up of the locations you used and placement. Also, how did you figure out the center of the 20x12 box? I know you used an abnormal location size for your Y locations.

[quote=name:Impersonation]So you center all of the X locations (1-20) over the center of the Y locations (~11-12). Then you simply center the big X location on the Scourge, then find which one of the X (1-20) locations its in. Then you center the Y location in the X location centered on the Scourge? AmIrite? If not, please explain how you did it in more depth. :) [img]http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/3062/eggballgrideu2.png[/img] This is a small mock up of the locations you used and placement. Also, how did you figure out the center of the 20x12 box? I know you used an abnormal location size for your Y locations.[/quote] To get the Y coordinate of the unit I just center the big Y location on each of the smaller Y locations and then check to see if a unit is in the big Y location. Basically it goes through the rows to chck if a unit is in a certain row. To get the X coordinate I center the X locations that vary in length on location Y14. Those x locations are so I can get the proper left/right offset. Then I center the big X location on the other X location (that I just centered on Y14), so that I can detect if a unit is anywhere in the column. However, since by centering the X locations that vary in size only along one edge of the map the centers only reach from that edge to the center of the map. To be able to get the centers all along the other side I have to center them on the other edge of the map. That's why there's a set of Y locations on each of edge of the map. As you can see in the picture you posted, the X locations are all aligned along the left side. The centers of those X locations only go from the very left to the middle of the map. They the centers can't possible reach the right side as long as they are aligned along the left edge. That's why centering the x locations along the left edge only covers the left half, and then I start centering on the right edge to get the other half.

Quote from Impersonation

So you center all of the X locations (1-20) over the center of the Y locations (~11-12). Then you simply center the big X location on the Scourge, then find which one of the X (1-20) locations its in. Then you center the Y location in the X location centered on the Scourge? AmIrite? If not, please explain how you did it in more depth.



This is a small mock up of the locations you used and placement. Also, how did you figure out the center of the 20x12 box? I know you used an abnormal location size for your Y locations.

To get the Y coordinate of the unit I just center the big Y location on each of the smaller Y locations and then check to see if a unit is in the big Y location. Basically it goes through the rows to chck if a unit is in a certain row.

To get the X coordinate I center the X locations that vary in length on location Y14. Those x locations are so I can get the proper left/right offset. Then I center the big X location on the other X location (that I just centered on Y14), so that I can detect if a unit is anywhere in the column.

However, since by centering the X locations that vary in size only along one edge of the map the centers only reach from that edge to the center of the map. To be able to get the centers all along the other side I have to center them on the other edge of the map. That's why there's a set of Y locations on each of edge of the map. As you can see in the picture you posted, the X locations are all aligned along the left side. The centers of those X locations only go from the very left to the middle of the map. They the centers can't possible reach the right side as long as they are aligned along the left edge.

That's why centering the x locations along the left edge only covers the left half, and then I start centering on the right edge to get the other half.

[quote=name:devilesk][quote=name:Impersonation]So you center all of the X locations (1-20) over the center of the Y locations (~11-12). Then you simply center the big X location on the Scourge, then find which one of the X (1-20) locations its in. Then you center the Y location in the X location centered on the Scourge? AmIrite? If not, please explain how you did it in more depth. :) [img]http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/3062/eggballgrideu2.png[/img] This is a small mock up of the locations you used and placement. Also, how did you figure out the center of the 20x12 box? I know you used an abnormal location size for your Y locations.[/quote] To get the Y coordinate of the unit I just center the big Y location on each of the smaller Y locations and then check to see if a unit is in the big Y location. Basically it goes through the rows to chck if a unit is in a certain row. To get the X coordinate I center the X locations that vary in length on location Y14. Those x locations are so I can get the proper left/right offset. Then I center the big X location on the other X location (that I just centered on Y14), so that I can detect if a unit is anywhere in the column. However, since by centering the X locations that vary in size only along one edge of the map the centers only reach from that edge to the center of the map. To be able to get the centers all along the other side I have to center them on the other edge of the map. That's why there's a set of Y locations on each of edge of the map. As you can see in the picture you posted, the X locations are all aligned along the left side. The centers of those X locations only go from the very left to the middle of the map. They the centers can't possible reach the right side as long as they are aligned along the left edge. That's why centering the x locations along the left edge only covers the left half, and then I start centering on the right edge to get the other half.[/quote] I thought that the location would "bounce" back into the map because it can't go outside of the maps' limits? I pictured it as all of the long X locations (1-20) would just be on top of each other and all in the center of location Y14/Y'14. Why not just make it the same size as the Y locations and already have them in there spaces. (EX: Make each of the X locations smaller and then just pre-place them in the editor and have them go (1-20) centered in the Y14 location all the way to the other side)

Quote from (U)devilesk

Quote from Impersonation

So you center all of the X locations (1-20) over the center of the Y locations (~11-12). Then you simply center the big X location on the Scourge, then find which one of the X (1-20) locations its in. Then you center the Y location in the X location centered on the Scourge? AmIrite? If not, please explain how you did it in more depth.



This is a small mock up of the locations you used and placement. Also, how did you figure out the center of the 20x12 box? I know you used an abnormal location size for your Y locations.

To get the Y coordinate of the unit I just center the big Y location on each of the smaller Y locations and then check to see if a unit is in the big Y location. Basically it goes through the rows to chck if a unit is in a certain row.

To get the X coordinate I center the X locations that vary in length on location Y14. Those x locations are so I can get the proper left/right offset. Then I center the big X location on the other X location (that I just centered on Y14), so that I can detect if a unit is anywhere in the column.

However, since by centering the X locations that vary in size only along one edge of the map the centers only reach from that edge to the center of the map. To be able to get the centers all along the other side I have to center them on the other edge of the map. That's why there's a set of Y locations on each of edge of the map. As you can see in the picture you posted, the X locations are all aligned along the left side. The centers of those X locations only go from the very left to the middle of the map. They the centers can't possible reach the right side as long as they are aligned along the left edge.

That's why centering the x locations along the left edge only covers the left half, and then I start centering on the right edge to get the other half.

I thought that the location would "bounce" back into the map because it can't go outside of the maps' limits? I pictured it as all of the long X locations (1-20) would just be on top of each other and all in the center of location Y14/Y'14. Why not just make it the same size as the Y locations and already have them in there spaces. (EX: Make each of the X locations smaller and then just pre-place them in the editor and have them go (1-20) centered in the Y14 location all the way to the other side)