The bible says that man was created before and after the animals in two different stories.

I'm not sure what you mean, but the bible is still pretty important and has a lot of good lessons in it, regardless of whether or not there was a global flood. It's very much likely that there was a very large flood from a remarkably cold/wet winter coupled with a 1000+ year storm.

@rockz http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/2009/06/15/contradictions-two-creation-accounts

yep. Open your mind ;0 if you allow the possibility of God, anything is possible.

I'd say even Noah and his family had done some bad stuff too; who hasn't? The problem was that there were no other Christians except Noah and his family, so the rest of the world was an abomination to God, and not worth keeping alive. The reason God doesn't do the same thing today is because there is a huge number of Christians in the world.

Yes, incest happened in the early days of the world. It wasn't sinful because there was enough genetic potential in people back then that the kids didn't get all mutated. Now, genetic potential is much more limited so if cousins have a kid it gets mutations. The thing about the stuff the Bible forbids and commands is that they're always good for humans. When it became dodgy, incest was forbidden. Stealing is forbidden because it's bad for people. The Israelites were commanded to have a spade-like tool on the end of their spears to dig latrines when on the warpath, because it's bad for humans to have uncovered feces lying around. Etc.

@ray I believe the Bible is true, and the other religion's books are false. I have faith that this is correct. There is nothing I can show to an outside observer that will prove that the Bible is more religiously accurate than the Koran (historicity and consistency is maybe another matter ;0 ). I don't think there's any way to prove one philosophy is more true than another, let alone religious books.

My assumption is that the entire Bible in it's original written form is written by men who were inspired by God to write a 100% accurate book. Most materialists assume that what they can see or experience is real. Bigbangers (kekeke) assume that matter existed before the first big bang. Some philosophies require more than one assumption.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Apr 27 2011, 11:01 am by Jack.

I've re-read the bible and found some more stupid things...

Story of Cain
Wiki Link *read the part about the wanderer*


The bible also said that pulling out is a sin, not a a big deal but when you really think it also means that condoms and contraceptive isn't allowed.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+38%3A9-10&version=KJV


Story of the judges is pretty brutal to say the least.
http://www.drbo.org/chapter/07019.htm

So what is the lesson of being raped and abused? The lesson is that you should than brutally mutilate your (wife?) concubine and then scatter the body parts .

Gen 30: 37 - 39 is not really messed up but its strange.
http://www.drbo.org/chapter/01030.htm


No most bibles are not in the original form most bibles nowadays are in different versions... Some versions that i know of are the King James version, King James authorized version, and catholic bible.

And yes its true all holy books claim to be accurate so in itself each "bible" contradicts one another.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Apr 27 2011, 7:49 pm by Tempz.

No, that means that Cain's skin was darker. That's all. You can't say the bible indirectly says black people are bad based off of that.

If it really means contraceptives and condoms are both not okay in the case of adulterous acts, why is this a "stupid thing" that you've read in the bible?

That's just someone's interpretation of the story, so who cares. If you want to make claims like this against text, then cite the text as your source not some website that for all I know could put anything up for reading.

I advise you read the bible on your own to come up with your own conclusions rather than reading things online.

I've got a bible in my hands and it is exactly like on the website...

Well similar enough =p

I understand there are different versions of the bible... which one are you referring to?

I understand, but if you're just reading online other peoples' opinions then you're not using your own brain in any meaningful way. I don't think it's healthy for you or for the discussion, is what I'm trying to say. I'm not trying to say they are right or wrong.

Its my opinion, i just wanted proof to back it up.

Well, then don't back up your opinion with an opinion. PM me if you want to talk about this more, as we don't want to clog the thread up too much.

Well the Earth is there before "Creation" Starts so the dinosaurs could have been there before the Bible.

People were created in the first story.
In the second story Adam was made. He was the first farmer.

FKXKANFNSXJSNDJXJSUSHDSDFSDFSDF lost my post. Let's try again.

The Bible never says Cain was black, it just says he was marked in some way.

It was the man's sleeping with his brother's wife that was the problem, not pulling out. The man pulled out so what he did wouldn't seem so bad.

If you read the Judges passage more carefully you'll see that the man sent his wife's body parts to the twelve tribes of Israel to shock them into seeing just how depraved the men of Gilead had become. In response the rest of Israel sent an army to burn down the city of Gilead.

http://www.biblestudymanuals.net/gen30.htm explains the striped sticks.

I never said the modern translations are the same as the original manuscripts (although the translators try very hard to get them accurate).

K_A, do you believe the Bible is the inerrant word of God? If so, the Bible says that before creation only God existed. It also says the world was created in six days, and on the sixth day Adam and Eve were created. The two creation stories are the same story, there is no conflict. The second version focuses on the sixth day, but there is no contradiction.

@Jack well fueling a blood war over a small group of people seems a little barbaric. I'd be okay with it if the person's atrocity is similar to that of Stalin, Hitler, or some more darker some communist leaders.
I understand what he did now; he sent his concubines body to the states of Israel to get revenge. The entire country/or state? must pay for the small group of people who raped them... doesn't seem fair to me.

Edit : The fueled blood war has logic to it, that i admit; its better than what we fuel wars today... oil, pride, and of course the girl the launched a thousand ships.

Well the "marking" of Cain is generally thought to be darkening of the skin.

I do agree with you jack... translation of the original Hebrew bible doesn't translate well into English but i have to admit they do a good job of getting it as close as possible.

If there's one moral lesson that the bible teaches, it's that a single man's actions are enough to condemn all other members of a species/group/community. Because, y'know, I'm clearly guilty of Adam's sin.

Good point, i still however think the war could of been avoided. One such war i remember was started In New Zealand when a group of brits put up a flag and the villages chief chopped it down leading to a war.

Okay. I have an idea then:

C = chance of being correct
T= total number of sect/religion/belief system/philosophies (let's call this SRBSPs for short) ever created

Statistically, the probability of a SRBSP actually being true can be found by using C = (1 / T) %

Let's say the number of distinctive SRBSP is 10,000 (T = 10,000)

C = (1 / T) %
C = (1 / 10,000) %
C = .0001 %

Any individual religion, in this scenario, has a .0001% chance of being right. Then, as T increases and approaches infinity (there are infinite permutations of SRBSPs), T gets even smaller, approaching 0 but never quite getting there.

So, I suppose, the chance of the Bible being correct is pretty unlikely. Why don't people convert to as many non-exclusive religions as possible( to maximize my chances of a happy afterlife)?

By that logic (which is fucking retarded), I will discredit every religion by just making up my own. This is true despite whether or not my new beliefs make any sense at all. Besides, creating my own belief does not reduce the likelihood of a pre-existing one by any amount. Also, if there was ever only one religion, it was instantly correct until someone made another one, at which point it stopped being true. Also, the universe didn't exist before there was any religion. So, as a result of my statistical analysis, your system makes no sense. You will not be able to prove any sort of metaphysics through science or statistical analysis. It remains outside the realm of both. Attempts to apply them outside their realms will yield results as spectacularly stupid and useless as yours.

Depends on who you ask. I don't believe that.

As for the rest of your response, I also think your post helps me believe that all religions were made up. You're throwing ray's math back as if it should be laughed at because clearly there are religions that weren't fabricated, but not all of us think that way. We've already had so many varying religions throughout history, and I find it hard to believe that all of them (and by "all of them," I mean what would probably be considered "legitimate" religions) were right.

I'm completely agnostic and if I were to want to follow a religion, I'd want to believe in the power of the Greek gods. I'm not joking or trolling, I really like the idea of their gods. The funny thing to me, though, is that I imagine most people would laugh at anyone saying they believed in those gods. I bet the common response would be that it is impossible for them to exist, as they were invented to explain how things worked (things that have since been proven by science). I guess the irony there is that the same science that could prove that could probably be used to explain why God doesn't exist, or that one could argue that the idea of God was convenient to help explain things as well.

Can you prove this is false and Christianity is true then:
Last night, the great Flying Spaghetti Monster descended to me. I was shocked and cried in terror, but He brushed my left eye with his Noodly Appendage and I saw in my eyes the birth of the sun and the moon, the vastness of the majestic universe, and the Holy Realm where He rests among other creator of worlds, and then He brushed my right eye, and again I saw the Essence of Life, and the Hand that Wrote it all, and I could read and understand all the chronicles of the world that would be faced by my children, my grandchildren and my great grandchildren. When I finished, He enlighted me, and I found my long lost cousin, uncle, great grandfather and cat brought back to me. He then said unto me: "Everything has been written, and it is not within your power to affect your children's future in anyway, or to claim a honorable seat with me in the Great Hall of the Pasta when you've come to your Inevitable End, so live it as pleases you." I was thus trusted with the knowledge of His great Existence, and likewise now I shall inform others of my experience, so that we can sit back and enjoy our lives we meet our Inevitable End.

This all of course doesn't attest to the belief in henotheism-- especially those who believe all gods exist. That makes them have a 100% chance of being right, correct?

Depends what you mean by prove. If by prove you mean gather scientific evidence to support a conclusion, then no.

@Rai
I really like your metaphor of how we should live our lives and be good people not because of some spaghetti monster in the sky says so.
I believe that the bible and god is for what it is; A big lesson on how humans should treat other humans. Without the bible you can still be a good person but the problem here is there is no incentive to do so. Bringing my belief that the bible was designed and created to control the unwashed masses.

Your statement on is to me false, you are the master of your own destiny. Unless you were talking in a manner which would alter that statement incorrect. I do like your phrase "live it as you please" which freedom is implied and saying life should be enjoyed

@Cecil
Well what if you don't know if someone has aids... and you mustn't use a condom with them, protection like condoms is there to prevent disease so its like god slapping protection of the human body when the bible doesn't allow condums.

Another Tempz Statment
Reading the bible won't make me necessarily go into god's arms because i have read the some of the bible and i am still an atheist. No i didn't find that the bible gave me faith however it did make me think that there is a higher power. So in a way it did make be believe in a god. Without getting to off topic it got me getting the idea of rebirth instead of heaven which would prove god doesn't exists in the same way evolution disproved god.

I bet there are plenty of error

Post has been edited 5 time(s), last time on Apr 28 2011, 7:44 am by Tempz.