Well late game, even if you waste time rebuilding them, your opponents waste time running to them and killing them, when they could be killing spawn for feed. Not to mention, if you have other assims on the map, you and your allies will still be gaining money while your opponents try killing each new one you build.

I think if assimilators fed a fairly large amount of exp when killed, then that would probably make up for the time it takes it kill them in the early game.

Nah I think the idea is that capturing a base should give you gradual EXP

Odd. When I was spending all my time building assims, even when I wasn't killing anything, I was still gaining experience and leveling up. Was that because of my allies killing stuff or the assims?

yes, 1/4 of your exp goes to allies.

Gee, moose sure is a swell guy.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Oct 1 2008, 7:16 pm by ClansAreForGays.

I think he meant that after the acher killed the assims, moose used his probe to rebuild the assims, even though the assims died quickly, so it did not benefit the team much. I don't think Moose edited his version at all.

ooooooooooooo, nvm

Petition - Use the Command Center as an Hero
First - It would be original!
Second - It could be done, you would have enough locations (lol 127 in 1.2?), unused units, and possibly enough switches for the next idea:

Command Center - Flying Fortress
The basic idea of this unit is a unit that can summon the spawn units, and, eventually, ultra-powerful hidden units that can not be created elsewhere.
HP - 8000?
Armor - High

Create locations around the map to prevent it from moving randomly.
Create a location and make it follow the CC.
Spawns should use gas, or minerals if the CC auto-gains minerals, just SLOWLY.
Either force it to use the "New Spell" unlock with stat points, or unlock new spawns automatically after level ups.

Spawns:
Lv. 1 Broodlings
Lv. 3 Zerglings
Lv. 6 Marines
Lv. 10 Firebat
Lv. 15 Vulture
Lv. 20 Goliath
Lv. 25 Zealot
Lv. 32 Dragoon
Etc.

Maybe use air units, but that would be cheap for those without air attack.

Spell 1 - Two Options
Bribe - Causes enemy temple to unally the enemy Heroes, OR causes enemy Heroes to ally you, OR causes enemy Heroes to unvision each other (One of above, or random)
Enemy Intelligence - Enemy temple ally-visions you.

Spell 2 - Cash Infusion
Mana to Minerals. Maybe random mineral gain.

Spell 3 - Three Options
Bribe could work here
Rally Call - Summons some Marines, Firebats, etc., but would be useless if spawns cost gas.
Protected Retreat - Invincibility to the CC, but no spawn/mana gain.

Spell 4 - Charge
All units invincible for a short while.

So there you go. My idea for the CC. I'll just close my eyes and hope.

GL&HF!

So...will the spawned units be controlled by the Command Center player or by the allied computer?

Also Spell criticism:
Bribe: The 1st possibility is pretty much useless, the 2nd possibility is equivalent to invincibility, and the 3rd possibility is only good during night
Enemy Intelligence: Only good during night

Cash Infusion: Again, does the player control their spawned units, and if so, can he use minerals to upgrade them?

Charge: Specify "All". Does this apply to everyone on your team, only your spawned units, both your team and the enemy team, or something else?

Also, the CC's spawns will be an incredible source of feed to enemy heroes, which will likely lead to your team's eventual loss if enemies feed off the CC.

In addition, Summoner already has the whole "Summon units" theme covered.

Command Centers should have:

255 armour + 255 unused 60 armour.

Name it: Godlike

The CC player.


The Bribe spell would cause the enemy spawns and temple defense turn on the enemy heroes for a while. Yeah the second one is, but the spawns and cannons, etc., will still attack you. Spells still affect you, and the enemy player can A+Click a million times to attack, but it's still pretty similar, i guess.


Yeah he can upgrade.


Everyone on a player's team.


It's not auto. It can be controlled and the player can simply stay near base. Urine should use the remaining units for hero-class spawns which, though they feed like spawns, are really powerful compared to spawns. Late-game spawns need more balance and should be stronger


Yeah. I guess, but a CC is MUCH COOLER than a defiler. Maybe 2.0?



Oh yeah. Try this. Play a 3v1 where the three players concentrate on upping spawn. What will happen?

Try it yourself, and post a replay.

WOW that was fast.

I have to do my homework right now. Sucks. I probably will tomorrow.

Aven, he's already created the design for the 3 secret units. New comers should really take the time to read this entire topic, it already answers most of your questions. Then again I should really take the time to update the first post.

http://www.staredit.net/89706/

Also, the reason for 1.4m was to fix abuses that really needed to be addressed. Urine has even said himself that he doesn't have time to make a new version anytime soon, so moose did it.

There has been some discussion and some ideas that have been brought to the table is things like Special Ops being re-vamped given mostly new spells and generally just made to be a lot more fun... Mech L4 being re-vamped and my suggestion is that maybe an already existant hero or one new hero should get night vision... I think the terrain though blocky serves its purpose... v1 was too small (IMO) and 1.4 was way too imbalanced, and annoying... 1.4M takes out a few imbalances in the terrain and actually adds a few small paths which make a lot more strategic gameplay... MNeox needs to get 1.4M and upgrade the terrain

I mastered Ops and now you want to change it? Always trying to make the lil' kid sad.

It would be nice for the terrain to include... several realistic elements.

- Plateau? Usually located near bodies of water, but anywhere is fine.
- (Built from temple) Bastion? Sort of like an archer tower or w/e.
- Wildlife (For general ambiance and interferance).

What you're talking about is a drastically new game, not a gradual fix which is all 1.4m should be.

A totally revamped temple siege isn't a bad idea though(but giving another unit night vis is). Expect to see a design document from me about an open community project proposal sometime in the future. Until then, lets just stick to tweaking 1.4m

I skimmed it and I never once saw me use the word "fix" in that whole paragraph, I used find in notepad and it also never found the word fix...
I understood already that it was a huge change, but as I said, it was just a few ideas... I like another class having night vision but I also dislike it, i'm sorta torn between the two, on the one hand, Mutant gets to dominate the night and crap all over anyone... on the other hand teams that go assault, mutant + special ops don't leave the other team fully nukable, obviously there is the solution of Light Mage to storm or Infested Kerrigan to storm and ensnare, but only if they can find the ghost. The Summoner to plague, if he can find the ghost and really other then that you're shit out of luck, since I think most, if not all of the anti-cloak units would already be selected, giving another unit night vision could make it so no one team can hugely dominate the night time

Hi Guys! I'm very glad that you guys like my ma and are fighting about it XD..
I have came up with very novel ideas for the Spirit Bear (Now Beast Shaman) and I'm planning to start adding the new chars..

What I need is Moose's edited version of the map

I was looking on the list of changes.. and I have several questions: (this is because i know my triggers the best)
And I'm also asking because you guys should know the balancing as well as I do now.. And I might miss a lot of things.
1. Are the changes ALL done?
2. Did u srsly added the Inconsistant Max Mana for me? (<3 and Sorry XD I was lazy that day)
3. How was the balancing issues with making Level Up Spawn cost 4 civs? Note that if you're playing 2v2, you can right away choose to level up spawns.
4. You said u reset paralysis/spell effects upon death.. That includes at least 2x2x12 = 48 Triggers that you changed O.O .. did u really do all of it? Did u remove all the spell effects, i.e. Dark Mage L3 spell, L4 spell, etc. ?
5. The queens/dropship/valkyrie is a result of using "Hero Locations", which are centered on the hero and is only 2x2, rather than "arena".. which covers the entire arena. Smtimes the units, when created, is moved out of the lcoation, and therefore don't get killed. Did u change all of it?
6. Add Gradual Exp for capturing bases?? I Don't really know about that... if you've done it.. how did it turn out balance wise?
7. YOu Changed Mech to Regular Goliath?? There are TONS and TONS of Triggers that set the HERO mech? Did you actually went in and CHANGEd them ALL?? I.E the Healing Settings.. Spell settings, Location Centering.. ???
8. How is Summoner so far.. I had the most trouble with him...
9. Warrior's spells aren't supposed to be High Dmg.. It is supposed to be its weakness. Plus, It spawns a LOT of DT's, which is more for Confusion rather than real Damage. the Real damage should come from warrior itself. (But if u say that it's better, then okay..)
10. To Give the pylons controlled by players that left is only possible if the pylons was INSIDE the relative base... This is because the pylons are given to P12... and p12 could've been from force1 or 2.. so the triggers wouldn't be able to tell which player the pylon USED to belong to..
11. I should have fixed p2's spec ops stuff.. It turns out that I screwed up on P2 a lot.. I also had some screw ups for capturing bases =___=' but I think i looked into it and fixed it..

All in all.. for sm1 who didn't make the map to do so much work.. I am VERY VERY Grateful.. All the questions above are just me asking as the creator.. Since you're messing with MY BABY !! ! ! ! I just have to know as much as possible :C
Plus, I want to start working on the new chars.. To be honest, the glitches/imbalances was definately making me slow down.. I have to say that I Owe a lot to you.. and your name should definately be on the Map.. in the forces + briefings + description + ingame if u can (Altho i bet u already put ur name in ) I don't mind... Besides.. I didn't protect the map for this very reason.. As long as u don't remove my name, it's cool...

I also want your help with balancing the new chars when i'm done with them If i ever will finish them. I'm still pretty busy, especially these two weeks since i got job interview, and midterms, and term papers due IN THESE TWO WEEKS ! ! ! however after those, I can spare sm time...

Anyways!! I'm very glad that you guys enjoy the map .. I made the map from my passion.. I always wanted to see these types of 'classes' with crazy spells such as spawning a Bomber.. or making enemies spawn ur Broodlings (hell yeah!) . And, of course, the new chars will contain the same crazy type spells that will be balanced and blow ur minds away! =D


P.S. .. .CC hero? but of course

The only thing he did was put M on the end of the file name and in the mission briefing, I think he's editing the map mainly because we enjoy it and not because he wants fame from it, and I think if you plan to put Moose's name on it. ClansAreForGays definitely should be named, since he helped moose test a lot and it was us playing so much that helped us figure out balancing issues.

And my name. Because I theoretically tested it.