In the same chapter of John, verses 1, 2, 6, 7, 9, 10, 11, 12, and 13 all make mention of the Father. And, as I quoted earlier, John 12:49 indicates that Jesus has not spoken of himself, "but the Father which sent [him]." Why, then, should we assume Jesus is speaking for anybody but the Father in John 14:15?
Because he says "If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever:" He uses personal pronouns. As a simple way to put it. You'll have to go into greater detail about what he meant if he didn't mean himself when he said "I", "me", and "my".
Are you implying the punishment for murder is the same as the punishment for breaking a traffic law? I'll agree that those who live in their sin, refusing to take part in the atonement of Jesus Christ, will suffer a spiritual death--the separation of oneself from the presence of Heavenly Father.
I'm saying that if someone lives disobeying the law of man, which we are to follow as long as it does not go against God's law, and someone else lives as a murderer their spiritual punishment would be the same.
This is talking about Jesus and as I've stated before, Jesus ascended to the glory of God and speaks of the Father. "The mighty God" and "everlasting Father" attest to the power and immortality of Jesus Christ, which he inherited from the Father.
I've mentioned earlier that Jesus rose to the perfection of the Father, so what is stopping him from also becoming a God?
So Jesus is 'The mighty God", and "The everlasting Father"? If Jesus Christ has the same power as the Mighty God and Everlasting Father he has the same power and immortality of the Father? And you worship Jesus Christ? In any shape or form, you worship Jesus?
Exodus 34:14 "For thou shalt worship no other god: for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:"
If that is a different kind of worship why did they not use another word? I have a Greek/Hebrew dictionary in my concordance. This can give me the definition of the Greek words used in the New Testament. Before anyone says "That's proof that the Bible is filled with erronous translation." I'll use this example. When you see a word in a book you're reading that you don't know; you go and look it up in the dictionary. I'll leave that at that, but I have a feeling someone will say something. Anyway. The Greek word used in Matthew 2:2 where the wise men worshiped Jesus, and then in Matthew 28:17 when the disciples worshiped Jesus is proskuneo, pros-koo-neh'-o;
to fawn or crouch to, i.e. (lit. or fig.) prostrate oneself in homage (do reverence to, adore):--worship. This same worship is what Satan wanted from Jesus in Matthew 4:9, and the same worship that Jesus told him was meant for God Matthew 4:10.
Now you can criticize my source there, but my point is that the word worship means 1 thing, not 2 different senses of the word. The worship they gave Jesus is the same worship they gave God.
Scriptures regarding the Corporeal Nature of God: Gen. 1:27 God created man in his own image; 5:1 God created man, in the likeness of God made he him; 9:6 in the image of God made he man; 32:30 Jacob sees God face to face; Ex. 24:10 they saw the God of Isreal, there was under his feet; 31:18 tables of stone written with the finger of God; 33:11 Lord spake unto Moses face to face; 33:23 thou shalt see my back parts; Luke 24:39 for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have; John 14:9 he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; 2 Cor. 4:4 Christ, who is the image of God; Philip. 2:6 who, being in the form of God; 3:21 our vile body...fashioned like unto his glorious body. I could continue but the list is long enough as it is.
Thank you for filling in my lazyness. What about John 4:24 "God is a Spirit". So then my analogy would apply that God is three in one. I believe that God made us in his image not only in this outward sense (2 legs and arms as one said before), but in the sense that we are a trinity being made of the spirit, soul, and body. Trinity in the dictionary is explained as
divine unity of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This is not in purpose, but as described before. As our belief that is.
I was reading today, and I found a couple of other interesting points to bring up. Both are in John.
John12:26 "If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour."
Here I see Jesus saying that he has servants, and that it is okay for him to be served. This passage speaks of us serving Jesus, because right after that Jesus says that whosoever will serve him his Father will honour. So let me go through a spiel here. In Deuteronomy 11:1 God commands us "Therefore thou shalt love the Lord thy God, and keep his charge, and his statures, and his judgments, and his commandments, always." So when God says something, you should always keep it. God says in verse 16 "Take heed to yourselves, that your heart be not deceived, and ye turn aside, and serve other gods, and worship them;" It says not to worship, nor serve any other gods. You just said "
I've mentioned earlier that Jesus rose to the perfection of the Father, so what is stopping him from also becoming a God? So not only does the Bible say that we worship and serve Jesus, but also on a side note Jesus said that if we love him we would keep his commandments just as God did in verse 1 of Deuteronomy 11. So in the logic of my blunt father, which tickles me sometimes, Jesus is either God or he is a false god.
Second point: John 8:12 "Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life." Jesus is the light of the world, neh? In John 12:35-36 "Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not wither he goeth. While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light." So Jesus is saying in a nutshell: I am with you a little longer {because soon he would be crucified}. Walk with me while I am here so that the darkness doesn't come upon you. While I'm here, believe in me that you may be my children.
My point is that in John 1 it speaks of Jesus and says in verse 12 "But as many as received him {Jesus}, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:" So in John 1 it says that as many as believe in Jesus' name are the sons of God. In John 12 it says that as many believe in him {the light} are his sons. So I'm taking mathematical logic here. Let's say that the sons of the light = A, the sons of God = B, and all those who believe = C. A=C, B=C, therefore A=B.
Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Feb 16 2009, 9:24 pm by Encore.
None.