"Creator gods" by definition differ from "THE creator god" in that creator gods are one of many gods and thus lack the omnipotence and "be-all and end'all" quality that is shared by Allah, Yahweh, and the Christian God. Which has been confirmed to be, in fact, the same god. Creator gods are a common concept, yes, but they cannot be said to all be the same.

Philosophy and Theory of Religion
By Marine

All religions are based from the very beginning of basic belief, such as life after death or the belief of one or many gods, in which there is one ‘creator god’. Some old religions have recorded the creation of all gods from one higher being or entity, and the other gods and all life are branched from this one being.

In all religion there is always one higher god than all others and it is the sole creator god. Through belief, terms and shapes of God have overshadowed the basic branch of the first religions. Through time, however, these terms and shapes have changed and moved. Along with these changes, new religious practices were formed and believed.

Even though all religions seem different, they all branched off from one basic belief.

In respect, all creator gods are essentially the exact same thing, just under the terms and beliefs of different religions put them seperate as their own 'creator god'. Despite all the names and looks, it is exactly the same thing.

All religions believe in a hell and heaven, just like i said in their own terms. Christians view hell as a pit of dead souls and fire and demons, and the Devil on his grand throne. Catholics view a little differently, but it is essentially the same thing. Same with Jews, Hindus, Muslims, Buddhists, and most other religions. What you guys don't understand is what I have been trying to say this entire time. Heaven is your own salvation, no one else’s. Hell is your worst fear, no one else’s. No matter what you believe, your heaven is your true faith, and your hell is your worst fear.

Atheists might not believe in anything, but they are their own religion. They have a hell and heaven, just no God or Devil. That is what separates Atheism from organized religion (others anyway). Atheists believe in reincarnation (or a few anyway) but no god to do it. That is their heaven; to be reincarnated into e new body and life. If they fear death and nothing after death, that is their hell. Death. Blackness. Dieing.

All religions are in their own way connected and the same. Over time and through people they have all morphed into their own 'separate' group. Really, it is not true that a religion is any different than another. Over time, the shape and look of the God(s) or deities, the ways to worship, the views of the people, its all been morphed from every other religion, and a base of one. Neanderthals realized this. They had no organized religion but through their sites we have found they buried their dead, which is an indication of some sort of afterlife.

Think about it. You have two complete opposite religions, right? Well lets look at it this way... They both have one God, or 'creator' that made their world. Hmm.. not so different. They both have a heaven and hell.. HMM NOT SO DIFFERENT AGAIN. they both have morals, values, and commandments. Wow, these two are really looking similar aren't they? The only difference is this: The WAY they shape their God, the WAY they describe their heaven and hell, and the WAY they wrote their commandments. The only thing truly separating these two, is their faith, or 'way of believing/worshipping', and the amount of people following their faith.

With each term alike and the differences ruled out, we can go into the depths and core beliefs of religion.

One of the first major religions of the world was Roman Catholicism. Their beliefs and practices were not that different than that of modern day Catholicism. But they are different in their own way. They believed in the basic vision of Hell and Heaven. The judgment after death decides where you go, etc, etc. Your deeds and time in your life are evaluated by God and he decided your life after death.

Between modern day Catholicism and Roman Catholicism the difference is Jesus, and belief that he is the son of God. Jesus sacrificed himself on the cross for all sins of his people, and some will argue he was Jewish or apart of the religion born from his crucifixion, Christianity. Personally, I believe Jesus was the son of God and apart of the Jewish religion. I believe he was Jewish for his father was God and he did believe in God religiously. The fights of Jesus’ religion have separated many religions from being attached to each other and to share the light of God. But if Jesus was Jewish, and his followers grew Christianity, what did God believe? That question along with MANY others has prompted some Atheism here and there. Apparently, God cannot be a religion because God would not believe in himself/herself/itself, because God knows himself/herself/itself and the fact that God exists.

Judaism and the religions Christianity and Catholicism have been disputing the beliefs of God and Jesus and many other things, i.e. the bible (just an example) for thousands of years. Question is why? Why would three religions based from the first basic beliefs and one event fight? They all nearly believe the same thing, the same God, the same event, but they don’t care. They don’t care because they do not see the similarities between each other. They only see the differences and that is all they care about, how to rag on the people who believe differently. They don’t realize even to this day that the ‘creator god’ of every religion is the same God in its own aspect, and yet, no one knows where this great being came from. Where DID God hail from? This is what challenges religion the most and what has prompted Atheism the most as well. The answer lies in the simplest thing we could find to explain it. The Big Bang.

Since the Big Bang theory, the major religions have stated that ‘God created the singularity that began the universe’ and left it at that. This was a great accomplishment for believers in God. An explanation no one could ever possibly take away from them. I believe differently, in my own way, respectfully. In my research and experience and beliefs I believe I have found my own personal answer to the question ‘Where did God come from?’ well, I believe God was the darkness before the light. God was everything before the singularity, but the singularity was God’s doing. ‘The Spark of Life’ some like to call it, was God creating life indeed.

Since I am probably one of the only ones who believe that some of you probably think I’m a bloody idiot. The religions will judge people who believe differently from them and will stick to their mass beliefs. But that is just it. People who go to church, synagogue, masque, or any other religious mass just do not believe in what they want. They are all allowing their priest, pasture, prophet, pope, or whoever it is teach them what THEY believe. And what the pasture believes is what the leader believes. It’s a long chain of forced believing. And if you don’t believe what I say, ‘God will punish you and condemn you to Hell.’ NO, NO, NO! People must believe what they want to believe, not what someone else does. If they choose and wish to believe someone else’s beliefs that is their poor miserable choice.

Through Judaism, Catholicism, Christianity, Hinduism, Islam, Buddhism, and Mormons, many other smaller branches have been made. Thousands even. Through these, the look of God and religion and the way to believe has been further changed and distorted. If all the people went back to the origin of it all, they would see that God and Hell and Heaven were just that. God was God, not Buddha or Allah or the Catholic God or the Christian God, it was just the simple God of life and creation. Their Hell and Heaven was basic, too. Heaven was just a place for good souls to rest and enjoy the afterlife and Hell was just a place for bad souls to finish out their punishment for bad deeds in the mortal life. No matter what there is a Hell and Heaven. Thing is, everyone has their own personal Hell and Heaven. But what about the ‘neutral state’?

A term that is not possible in apparent means (death)and brought up by O)MasterJohnny is the ‘neutral state’. The neutral state in death is impossible because life is that neutral state. Everything starts at this point of time and that neutral state is an opportunity for experience. The figurative ‘0’. In death your time for experience is over and you can one of two ways; up or down. Into the negative or into the positive. Your ‘neutral state’ experience decides that judgment. With death comes the closure of your life time, of course. Although reincarnation is believed by some religions, it is an illusion. One example is the caste system of Hinduism. They may reincarnate, but they really don’t. Their neutral state is many life times long to them and the ultimate escape from their neutral state is ‘nirvana’, or their heaven. If they cannot accomplish this ‘nirvana’ they go into a mind of hell. They are punished with the lowest caste system. Karma is a big part of this religion and the more life times it takes to reach nirvana the less Karma you are considered to have.

If you believe you will just die and rot, then that is your Heaven. Peace in death, and forever quiet in darkness and solitude. Your Hell would be anything but. Everyone’s Hell and Heaven is over looked by the one true God, the first God. Your judgment is your own and no one can make you believe anything you don’t want to.

The fights and differences between all religions have blinded them for real answers and questions. The similarities are always what matters more. Peace comes from agreement and understanding, and forgiveness. So lets look at the similarities of major religions. They all believe in a higher entity that is the sole ‘creator god’, right? They have beliefs and commandments, guidelines for what to believe and how. They have scribes that take their god’s words of guidance to make a holy book, full of great teachings, no? They all have a beginning event, too, that started the belief of that particular religion. They all have holidays or important events that are holy or preserved forever, i.e. the crucifixion of Jesus. So much more similarities come from these religions. If we all respected these similarities, along with the differences, there would be so much more peace and cooperation in the world. Yeah there would be arguments between different believers, which is normal. But the religions themselves could see the true face of God and Heaven and Hell, and God’s true teachings to mankind.

But looking at the differences religions have more to them than one would see at first glance. Complicated rituals or holidays, beliefs that would need and require a deep and true faith to your god, etc. Atheists choose not to believe because most are either ignorant to be able to see a higher being then mankind, or humans in general. Even themselves, which is pitiful and selfish. Some might not have enough views of true faith and religion. Others may just not have the energy to believe, or just can’t grasp the thought of religion and one great God that created everything around them. Because of some reasons, a lot of Atheists are narcissists. Its not hard to believe and connect yourself with God, and something so simple.

Science is what most Atheists stick to for their explanations. But science cannot explain what caused the singularity to be created. They can explain how it exploded and how the Big Bang happened exactly, but not what made the singularity. There are theories but not definite answers. This puts God responsible for this great event of the spark of life. It is unexplainable and impossible without God in the picture, so it just has to be. Because of this blank in history, religion has the existence of God in explanation right there. No one can take that away from the theists.

With so many different views and thoughts of God and religion out there, the look and explanations have changed drastically. Different gods exist to some religions such as Hinduism, possibly each being apart of the true creator god. But with all the religions out there, and all the beliefs and theories floating around, how do you know what to believe? My answer is follow your own path to seek faith and religious enlightenment. It is a journey no one can you help you on but God. Believe what you want, what you believe is true, and if that path is Atheism or something else no one can make you think differently. Your Heaven is your own sanctuary with God, and your Hell is your own doing.

With faith and your beliefs you will never let yourself down and your hold on reality and life will never let go. Your life will be peaceful and friendly, unless of course you are in the middle of war, despair, grief, stress, or something else that’s bad, but that is where God will help you along the path out of that hole. Your religion is yours.

That is my philosophy and theory of religion
- Marine

Many of you will disagree with my own personal reflection of religion and the state of it past present and furture, I understand that. Just have the courtesy and respect to be reasonable and truthful. Treat others the way you want to be treated

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jan 27 2009, 1:07 am by Marine.

So much of what you posted is bullshit...

You completely diregard Buddist and/or Jain views, as well as many other religions predominant in the world.

Ahem.

Catholicism is a sect of Christianity and Hindus and Buddhists state that there is no hell. Only levels of suffering for being a bad person. Purgatory.

Atheists do not beleive in the concept of superior beings. Why would this designate infinite sects of after life then?

All religions are connected in the fact that they are religions.
Most religions are connected because they try to mass convert.

The first major religion was Polythesism. And Greek/Roman gods. Not to mention things that happened in the Americas and across the continent. Hell, Hinduism, Buddhism and the like were far before Catholicism.

Judaisim, Christianity and Islam.
Each one has a different story, and although they are very similar, they vary. Atheism didn't begin because of the Big Bang.


If the infinite is already infinite, why would the infinite have to form something, when they can inifnitely place an infinite number of things?

A Pasture is where cattle graze.
People believe in things because it unites them. Unity for the win.

Hindus and Buddhists have no Hell. An infinite paradise and/or englightenment may be included as Heaven, but still. Buddha is also not considered a God. Thats like calling IP or Moose Gods because they "unite us" by operating the site.

If heaven is inifnite paradise
And hell is infinite suffering.
The null will be a void of nothing. The feeling of zero. A cold embrace of death.

I'm going to ask Syphon if he will "Enjoy" rotting in the ground.

Not all have creator gods.
Not all have beliefs and/or commandments.
Not all have holy books of scriptures.

If we all respected them, the world would not be exciting. War develops technology which in turn advances man kind.
Religions cannot see the face of anything. People may claim to have seen a God, but how can you trust them? Maybe it is true, maybe they DID see one. But where is the proof?

You really are one to convert people aren't you?
Athiests do not believe because they do not see a reason to believe. Religions have become so fucked up that it is impossible to abide by thier rules. Some religions are still normal, do not get me wrong, but others are completely ridiculous.
Science has facts to back up its claims, and usually they are correct.
Religion has tales that back up their claims, but do you know the validity?

You are a Christian trying to sway people over to your side. Heaven is your own personal bliss which cannot be affected. Hell is your own personal doom which cannot be affected.

Athiesm is a non-prophet organization.


I'm treating you the way I view a biased paper. You can go on and comment mine, I won't mind. Critiquing my work is actual very positive for myself.

Syphon and Nerdy, I needz j00 bax.

I believe in quantum immortality, vi3t. So no, I won't enjoy rotting in the ground. Because from my perspective, I will never experience death.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jan 27 2009, 6:27 am by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Provide the evidence and argument when you ave time. Kinda only

That was my point. You won't enjoy rotting in the ground so that wont be your paridise nor will it be your "Heaven".

Back to sleep I go.

@Marine: What if I am simply non-religious? How do i fit into your module?

I'm non-religious and I believe in my own personal 'heaven'.

Yet I am non religious and I do not.

This just in: Non religious people can have different beliefs. There's a reason that atheism isn't a religion: because not all atheists believe the same things.

and don't forget that some can have no beliefs =)
Why these religious folk lumpin us together man?

Some people lose there faith because heaven shows them to little, but how many people lose there faith because heaven shows them to much? -Unknown

I lost my faith along time ago. A couple churches I when too and some schools I when too made me think different about Christianity. A school at day which was suppose to be better than normal school but turned out fights everyday x.x. and a church at night which they thought men were superior than women. Other bullshit but after three or four churches and seeing people feel so bad and hearing god will help I just said fuck this and took off my church cloths and gave up. but thats just me( I just read the first post didn't read anything esle )

Okay Marine. You've told us WHAT it is you believe. Now, to ensure relevancy to the topic's title, tell us WHY.

Ok here is a large paragraph I wrote in a class online for my HS TOK. It covers your question.. Keep in mind that I was responding to someone who said that they don't care about whether or not God exists, and I refer to myself as Randy.. Also I'm sorry if a few things in this post are irrelevant, but it covers why you should believe pretty well.

Also, before anyone jumps on the "God existing" being as certain as "Gravity", I said in the post you have to cover the evidence for a theistic god existing on your own and then make a judgement, as there is plenty of evidence on this universe to make a judgement beyond a reasonable doubt that God exists.


To reply to Doodan about Evo being a scientific theory, and not a religion.

Definition of Theory according to merriam-webster: "the analysis of a set of facts in their relation to one another"\

Evolution is a set of conjectures which can not be directly tested. Thus I don't think that Evo qualifies as a theory, although that is just my interpretation of this definition, and I don't really care what anyone has to say to my opinion on Evo being a theory, its like arguing about what I think is red and what you think is red.

Definition of Religion according to merriam-webster: "a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith"

The first interpretation by merriam-webster said "the service and worship of God or the supernatural" Although there are religions which believe there is no god or supernatural, so I used another (the fourth in merriam-webster) interpretation which was more general.

Anyways, all religions answer four questions. Who we are, why we are here, how we got here, and where we are going when we die. What purpose does Evo have besides to answer these questions? None. Therefore I MYSELF see Evo as yet another religion.

Now about how someone said something like "I don't like religion because they are all "Believe in my god or go to hell!!"

Would you rather believe that all religions are true, do you not like the idea of telling people they will go to hell? Well sorry buddy, but all religions can not be true since so many are mutually exclusive. Say I believe that I am going to hell, you you believe I am not going to hell. Can we both be right at the same time? No. It is ridiculous to say that all religions are true. So if all religions can not be all true, then which one(s) are true, if any? This carries on into a HUGE discussion I won't enter into, but yes if Christianity is true, then everything else is false. This means that if Christianity is true, if you choose not to believe in Christianity freely, then you are going to hell. Now you can easily believe in "god" and not go to heaven, according to Christianity. So Christianity (or any religion), isn't necessarily "Believe in my God or go to hell!!", saying that is (I think) an extremely narrow minded, and ignorant claim. I think it is just a lame excuse to cop-out on making any effort to study any religion.

Bleh, there are a few other things I wanted to say, but I g2g!

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jan 28 2009, 6:05 am by CecilSunkure.

Having no belief is impossible. No matter WHAT, everyone has a worldview, and the "I dont have a worldview" claim really is a claim to "I dont care to worry about prescribing to a certain worldview", which is itself a worldview. And all atheist don't believe in a god, which is why you are lumped together (it is not just those religious people that "lump" you into a category). And even if you don't think atheism is a religion, it is still a worldview just like any other religion.

What if I think that you are an ignorant tool? Don't make unsupported and demeaning claims.

O)CecilSunkure, if I replaced the words, Christianity and God, in your posts with the words, Hinduism and Vishnu (or any other God of Hinduism); would you still agree with yourself?

Indeed it could be, though I could find no ( justified ) definition for within what wavelengths of light "red" fits into ( though according to Wikipedia, it's "approximately" 625-740 nanometers ) . We're talking about definitions here, so if you disagree, then either it's because of an ambiguous word in the definition, or a misunderstanding of the terminology/grammar on someone's part. You've demonstrated a nice tendency toward the latter already.
The fossil record is a collection of facts, genetic mutation is a fact ( and testable ) , genetic diversity, ... etc. are all facts. Evolution is a theory used to describe how all these facts can all fit into a coherent world.
^{[citation needed]}
"Who are we", in a spiritual or theological sense, is distinct from "Who are we" in an evolutionary sense ( Legos can be described as collections of bricks, in physical terms, or in their colors, shapes, silhouettes and manipulations in artistic terms; the two are not mutually exclusive ) . The same goes for "Why are we here" ( of the infinitely many possible gods, there are infinitely many who could have created a world in which evolution occurs, and engineered the initial world-state specifically to result in humans; going back to my Lego analogy, it's the hands of the kid putting them together versus his mind deciding in what manner to and for what reason ) . Evolution has nothing to do with "Where are we going when we die".
I'd already covered "Faith vs Reasonable Expectation".
Agnosticism is based on a lack of information with which to achieve conclusion on such a matter. I maintain a theoretically agnostic view of the universe because there is no basis on which I could say that god cannot exist, nor any other claim with absolute certainty, given the weak nature of perception.

@Cecil

Evolution has been directly observed and proven (ie, the spontaneous transformation of genes and speciation) in bacterium many, many times.

Cecil,

You've avoided my question. In a prior post you stated that the fossil record supports the argument that theism is true. I asked how it does that, since all the evidence (as best I've read) that has been uncovered supports the notion that life itself grows and changes on its own, without any (traceable) aid of a supernatural intelligence. You shot back with "Yes, evo is a religious belief." I asked, what does qualify as evidence for theism? Once again, you've failed to outline criteria for supporting evidence that favors theism. In your latest post, you went into great detail about examples about how gravity is a fact of the universe whether or not a person wants to believe it. The evidence in support of gravity is overwhelming and obvious to even the dimmest minds. Then you go on to say that if a person would just look around, that they will find evidence of there being a god, without actually giving any examples of what such evidence is. Again, what qualifies as evidence? A book falling if you let go if it is evidence for the existence of gravity. What day-to-day events point to God? (And don't say "all of them" because that's a cop-out, and if you don't see why, I probably won't be responding to you any longer)

Would it be something like "The sun rises every morning, god is watching out for us by providing us with heat and light." I would say no to that. We live on a planet. There are probably trillions of them in the universe. Having our own star is actually nothing remarkable at all, and believing that we should be thankful for it is not necessary for it to continue to exist or for us to enjoy it. In fact, the sun's existence probably isn't personal at all. Did you or a loved one survive a life-threatening ordeal against unlikely odds? Well, I'm happy for you, but that doesn't mean that there was a god looking out for you. What about the people that didn't survive their brushes with death? Did god like them less? I've been in life threatening situations before, and I've (obviously) survived. But it was because either I, myself, or someone else involved was quick witted enough to evade catastrophe. Although I did thank god at the time, god's existence or non-existence had nothing to do with my survival. Sometimes things just turn out in your favor. If you throw a pencil at a rake, odds are, it will hit the teeth and fail to pass through. But occasionally, the throw will be a good one and the pencil will go through the teeth without hitting any of them. That's not because god decided to show you a cool pencil trick this time, it's because the circumstances leading up to the event allowed it to play out like it did.

I get the impression (and please correct me if I'm wrong in my assumptions) that you grew up in a very hardcore Christian household. But as you've grown in your life, you've met people of other affiliations and you've discovered that they're not bad people at all. Surely all this stuff you've grown up believing about how terrible their afterlives are going to be just didn't ring true anymore. Therefor, you've been leaning away from some of the stricter interpretations of the religion you've been born in to. But you still believe, at your core, that your religion has a damn good chance at being the correct one. But is your interpretation correct, or is the stricter one of your parents correct? Okay, so maybe they both are. Well, does your particular denomination (I don't know how you were raised, specifically) have the upper hand on other denominations such as Mormonism, Catholicism, or Presbyterianism? Mayhap, but they're probably okay too, since they're all basically Christian beliefs at their core. But wait, Christianity hasn't been around forever. In fact, it has evolved (whoa, irony) out of other existing religions, some major, some minor (take a look for yourself). It takes a lot from ancient Judaism and other smaller religions (I'm tempted to call them cults) that dealt with life-death-rebirth mythologies for over a thousand years before Christ himself allegedly existed. Hmm... stories that are nearly identical to the Jesus mythology existing for a thousand years before Christianity's version of the timeline? Surely they can't all be correct...

My basic point is this: At what point do the subjective differences mean that a line has been crossed that is offensive to God? Religion itself has changed so much over time. Is the Christianity of the present more or less correct than Christianity of the Dark Ages? For instance, Catholics have long believed that unbaptized babies went to a place called Limbo, which is not heaven, hell, or purgatory. However, Pope Benedict (the one that is in power at this moment) has recently closed Limbo. Does that mean that all the babies that were there over the centuries can go to heaven now? Or does it only apply to unbaptized babies that died after the ruling? Does the Pope really have that power? And on and on we go.

Then there are those that try to reconcile the elephant-in-the-room evidence against the existence of a sky-wizard with the beliefs they would like to retain. For instance, I've heard the suggestion that maybe God wrote the rules of physics and set off the Big Bang and everything has unfolded based on his ultimate design scheme ever since. I say, if that is so, why bother thanking someone whose job ended 15 billion years ago? If I'm supposed to kiss the guy's ass who hasn't been to work for that long in order to get to heaven, I won't do it, because I'm not so convinced that this thing loves me if it makes those sorts of demands.

I don't find religion to be peaceful at all because when I actually bother to examine it, I cannot overlook what a serious mindfuck it is. I'm willing to bet that they're all wrong (despite every last one claiming to be right), that there is no "correct way to live," your choices will not be met with any supernatural rewards or punishments, and that you should make your life what you want it to be.

And I'm also rather irritated by your insistence that atheism or agnosticism somehow still qualifies as a religious-esque belief. It's like saying that every college student on my campus that does not belong to a student club is a member of the No-Club Club. That's simply not true. They are just not part of any organized social structure having to do with belief in the supernatural.

Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Jan 28 2009, 8:40 am by Doodan.

If religion makes people better people. Let them have religion.
If religion makes people worse people. Let there be no religion.
Religion is designed to make you better, not to forcedly convert people into a slave pit.

Wtf.

Religion is not about a "correct way to live." There's no such thing as a correct way to live. If someone has his ways of living, then so be it.

It is true that one can live a decent life without religion, but allow me to state my observations over the past several years.
The nicest, most humble and good mannered loving people and families are always religious in some way. And these people aren't limited to Christians. Many are Jewish, Muslim, or even Hindus or Buddhists. For instance, if you look at biblical figures like Jesus Christ himself, you can see how such a humble, nice, and good natured guy he is (unfortunately many Christians are very unlike him as Ghandi once said.) It is true that many religious people are not of any of these qualities (for instance, there are many Catholics from the Northeast area who aren't exactly nice people. No offense to any Roman Catholics here. As well as some religious fundamentalists) but it is rare for me to see such non believers with such qualities. Note: I am not saying that lacking these qualities mean that people are murderous, have no morals whatsoever, or have a bleak outlook to life. I've seen all sorts of people, religious, atheist, agnostics, etc. After knowing such groups of people, I tend to find the religious group to be a much much friendlier and warm environment. Some people I've met are dicks and complete assholes yes, but I think this group of people I know to consist slightly more of the non religious folk.

Correlation? Causation? This exactly same question(s) can be asked when talking about religiousness and intelligence. But hear me out; it IS possible for one to be a very nice, loving, humble, warm, and friendly person without religion (again, I'm not referring to just morals in general; i'm emphasizing heavily on personalities), but simply saying that they can won't cut it; people have to physically prove that they can do it. Based on my personal anecdotal research, few have proven so. I'm really sorry if anyone takes offense to this, but this is based my personal experience, not my overall generalization

And so because of this I challenge everyone to go prove to the world (especially to the religious world) that you have much better or equally warm personalities and lives as one that's of some sort of religion. Doing so will, rather than generate harsh sentimentality toward each other, but instead make this whole world a much better place to live in close the gap/division between the religious and the none so that everyone can finally accept people for who they are

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jan 28 2009, 10:04 pm by MillenniumArmy.