wait, so does this mean that different heroes have different kilscores? thus meaning that if i kill a hero with a low ks early game i might not get as much exp as i should?
That is bs if it's true...
You can kill each hero a maximum of 3 times. Therefore, special cases for each hero kill were put into the triggers to have them add killscore where necessary and equalize experience.
You can also have a flawless kills to cash system using kills score as well... For instance:
[PLAYERS]
[CONDITIONS]
- Current player's kill score is at least 50.
- Player 8 (Let's say they're the enemy) has suffered at least 1 death of Zerg Zergling.
[ACTIONS]
- Set deaths for player 8 subtract 1 for Zerg Zergling.
- Subtract Current Player's kill score by 50.
- [//Actions you want (IE: Gaining money and experience.)]
I've used this in plenty of maps and it works flawlessly, to my knowledge, even with splash. Of course, you need to do it with every single possible unit you could kill. This includes allied units due to splash damage effecting them.
Kill ScoresEDIT: Wow, I'm late on that response.
Problem scenario:
Players: Heroes
Conditions: Killscore is 200, P8 suffers 1 death of zealot
Actions: Add 10 XP, subtract 200 kill score, subtract 1 death of zealot for P8.
Players: Heroes
Conditions: Killscore is 100, P8 suffers 1 death of marine
Actions: Add 2 XP, subtract 100 kill score, subtract 1 death of marine for P8.
What happens: In the same trigger cycle, P2 kills a zealot and P1 kills 2 marines with splash.
P1 meets both conditions of the first trigger and gets 10 XP for a zealot kill that he didn't make. P2 gets shortchanged to 4 XP from the second trigger (running twice) because P1 caused P8 to have no deaths of a zealot that P2 himself actually killed.
Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Sep 4 2009, 12:30 am by Mini Moose 2707.
unholy incountered the problem that he couldn't make them give the same reward with the zealots and marines, and thus is why he couldnt switch them in the spawn waves in game... Because the killscores for the spawns go in an ascending order, and thus give more exp/minerals, since the amount of exp/mins given is based on the killscore of the unit. I did read your post, i just dont think you're right...
what you are referring to is kills to cash, where each individual unit has its own set exp/min amount, which is a lot harder and longer to trigger, especially with all the creeps. using killscore, you can't assign your own amount of killscore per unit, you use the killscore, which is different depending on what unit you have... for example, broods have a killscore of, i think, 50, and marines have 100, so if you kill 2 broods, you get the same reward that you would get if you killed a rine. But you can't modify killscore in any way, it is set in sc's programming i believe.
btw, i thought that might have been it moose, thanks.
Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Sep 4 2009, 12:30 am by ShredderIV.
None.
unholy incountered the problem that he couldn't make them give the same eward with the zealots and marines, and thus is why he couldnt switch them in the spawn waves in game... Because the killscores for the spawns go in an ascending order, and thus give more exp/minerals, since the amount of exp/mins given is based on the killscore of the unit. I did read your post, i just dont think you're right...
what you are referring to is kills to cash, where each individual unit has its own set exp/min amount, which is a lot harder and longer to trigger, especially with all the creeps. using killscore, you can't assign your own amount of killscore per unit, you use the killscore, which is different depending on what unit you have... for example, broods have a killscore of, i think, 50, and marines have 100, so if you kill 2 broods, you get the same reward that you would get if you killed a rine. But you can't modify killscore in any way, it is set in sc's programming i believe.
btw, i thought that might have been it moose, thanks.
Except killing two broodlings will not equal killing a marine, because two broodling kills will produce two broodling deaths, not one marine death. Do you even read what is posted? This kills system uses deaths of the computer as another condition, so it will identify what unit has died. Yes, it has flaws such as having to set the deaths of the unit to zero every time a computer kills something or splash, but you are not grasping the concept.
Please look at what he has down for triggers again before replying, please. You can also have a flawless kills to cash system using kills score as well... For instance:
[PLAYERS]
[CONDITIONS]
- Current player's kill score is at least 50.
- Player 8 (Let's say they're the enemy) has suffered at least 1 death of Zerg Zergling.
[ACTIONS]
- Set deaths for player 8 subtract 1 for Zerg Zergling.
- Subtract Current Player's kill score by 50.
- [//Actions you want (IE: Gaining money and experience.)]
I've used this in plenty of maps and it works flawlessly, to my knowledge, even with splash. Of course, you need to do it with every single possible unit you could kill. This includes allied units due to splash damage effecting them.
Kill ScoresEDIT: Wow, I'm late on that response.
None.
ultimo, that is not the trigger set that is used in ts, thats a proposed trigger set by lil inferno... maybe you should be reading more carefully... and that is a perfect klls to cash, and not kill score based. I repeat
THEY USE A KILLSCORE SYSTEM THAT CANNOT BE CHANGED SINCE IT IS IN SC'S PROGRAMMING!. The argument is that kills to cahs would work better, but the broodling thing is true...
ok, and looked it up... broods have a ks of 25, marines of 100, so in ts, you get the same killscore towards exp and money when u kill a rine, as if you killed four broods...
and i was referring to the current ts kills system, where it is based on killscore, i never said that the triggers lilinferno put down would work by 2 brood deaths equaling a marine death... i said in the current ts triggers, it will work that way.
None.
>be faceless void >mfw I have no face
He is saying it should be changed though and thought you were saying that the proposed system wouldn't work.
Red classic.
"In short, their absurdities are so extreme that it is painful even to quote them."
no, if he thought that, he shuda quoted me, as i never said the proposed system wouldnt work.
and you keep saying i didnt read your post... i did freakin read the post, and understood it... what you didnt understand was that i was at no point arguing it woldnt work, i was arguing that the current system in use for ts was based off of ks, whereas you later made it seem like you could create a just ks system that would work like kills to cash...
Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Sep 4 2009, 3:44 am by ShredderIV.
None.
The misunderstanding here is the naming of the system and never directly talking to us.. TassadarZeratul claims perfect kills to cash to be using most kills and you're claiming it to be deaths and kills scores (which is what I believe too), really, it's confusing. I'm was trying to claim that he could use a system similar to what lil-inferno posted but you kept going on about his system(unholy's), never directly addressing what me or lil-inferno said but posting enough relavant information to show that it looked like you were just ignoring what was posted. You should have said that the system could work then instead of going on about what unholy was using, most of us are aware of the system in place in TS.
Problem scenario:
Players: Heroes
Conditions: Killscore is 200, P8 suffers 1 death of zealot
Actions: Add 10 XP, subtract 200 kill score, subtract 1 death of zealot for P8.
Players: Heroes
Conditions: Killscore is 100, P8 suffers 1 death of marine
Actions: Add 2 XP, subtract 100 kill score, subtract 1 death of marine for P8.
What happens: In the same trigger cycle, P2 kills a zealot and P1 kills 2 marines with splash.
P1 meets both conditions of the first trigger and gets 10 XP for a zealot kill that he didn't make. P2 gets shortchanged to 4 XP from the second trigger (running twice) because P1 caused P8 to have no deaths of a zealot that P2 himself actually killed.
I don't play TS much, but would this scenario come up alot in the game?
None.
>be faceless void >mfw I have no face
He qouted you saying this:
what you are referring to is kills to cash, where each individual unit has its own set exp/min amount, which is a lot harder and longer to trigger, especially with all the creeps. using killscore, you can't assign your own amount of killscore per unit, you use the killscore, which is different depending on what unit you have... for example, broods have a killscore of, i think, 50, and marines have 100, so if you kill 2 broods, you get the same reward that you would get if you killed a rine. But you can't modify killscore in any way, it is set in sc's programming i believe.
And probably thought you were saying that it is impossible with the proposed killstocash, which you seemed to be talking about.
EDIT
Ultimo that would be rare, but possible, so splash could be a problem there. You would probably want a checking system. I forgdt how to do it.
Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Sep 4 2009, 3:50 am by zany_001. Reason: Phalanx of Light > hordes
Red classic.
"In short, their absurdities are so extreme that it is painful even to quote them."
no, it started when i asked about heroes killscores, which was in a link in lil's posting, and instead of an answer, like moose gave me, which was very straightforward, you just said that you could use killscores and get different amounts... I thought u meant, that in the current system, you could change killscores, which u can't, so basically it was a misunderstanding...
I don't play TS much, but would this scenario come up alot in the game?
yes, especially if two people are fighting off large waves of creeps at the same time, such as lm l1ing and summoner klling at the same time, it could easily be in the same triger cycle.
None.
>be faceless void >mfw I have no face
That specific one wouldn't unless spawn was upped. But I'm sure there is a checking system, when I can get on scmdraft I'll find it if I have time.
Red classic.
"In short, their absurdities are so extreme that it is painful even to quote them."
The argument is that kills to cahs would work better, but the broodling thing is true...
No the argument is that you actually said this
wait, so does this mean that different heroes have different kilscores? thus meaning that if i kill a hero with a low ks early game i might not get as much exp as i should?
This made inferno zany ultimo (and me) facepalm. The following spam of posts are you trying your damnedest not to be wrong.
The system would mess up if you splash your own spawn, though..
None.
@Kill to Cash system...
We all know that the current system. with 125 killscore = 4exp + 5 ores... has its problems when it is late game. However, it is much simpler and easy to work with than doing a whole slew of triggers for a perfect kills to cash system JUST to make zealots spawn before marines.
Also, the problem is mostly based on v1.5's spawn leader thing.
Slight adjustments to these spawns would suffice.
@CAFG's Mine capping idea thing.
It won't work because it looks unnatural, and unorthadox.. why would mines placed on a beacon be any different :\...
..But then again, why would mines be able to to connect a big warpgate...
Meh~.. I'd say, either keep mine-capping as it is. Or take out mine capping completely, and adjust the hero respectively.
Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Sep 4 2009, 7:03 pm by UnholyUrine.
None.
@CAFG's Mine capping idea thing.
It won't work because it looks unnatural, and unorthadox.. why would mines placed on a beacon be any different :\...
..But then again, why would mines be able to to connect a big warpgate...
This is an M version suggestion. Currently in the M versions mines disappear when place on becons so mine capping is disabled, and the player loses 25 gas.
I don't see it at all aesthetically displeasing, not that aesthetics should even take priority over functionality to begin with. My method is sound and is done in 3 small triggers. The only difference is mine capping can now be stopped more easily in more ways.
The argument is that kills to cahs would work better, but the broodling thing is true...
No the argument is that you actually said this
wait, so does this mean that different heroes have different kilscores? thus meaning that if i kill a hero with a low ks early game i might not get as much exp as i should?
This made inferno zany ultimo (and me) facepalm. The following spam of posts are you trying your damnedest not to be wrong.
no, we already determined it was a misunderstanding, i thought they said something , they thought i was referrin to something, w/e, we're over it cafg, stop trying to instigate...
and it was a legit question, considering i dont know anything about ts triggers... the good thing to do would to have just done what moose did and answer me that it gives a bonus ks when you kill a hero to make it even...
None.
Currently in the M versions mines disappear when place on becons so mine capping is disabled, and the player loses 25 gas.
That's not true and would be lame if it was. Though you don't get a full refund... I have to work on those triggers.
Anyone got a good Assault L4 yet? Or L3... Dropship is practically an L4 as it is. ;o
Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Sep 4 2009, 9:48 pm by Mini Moose 2707.
The system would mess up if you splash your own spawn, though..
That's why you make it for both sides. I clearly stated in one of my posts that you'd need to do it for
every enemy you could possibly kill, including allied units.
How about allow mines to be placed on beacons normally, but don't allow them to capture? It would mean a lot more trigger work, but it's doable.
None.
Nope it will definately be aesthetically displeasing, and also very dysfunctional.
To draw an example, anyone who just runs around laying mines.. would find if very unpleasant that all his mines placed on beacons were gone...
And it also doesn't make any sense to have 1 mine left on the beacon, magically brought down to 1% HP. This is true for any versions.
None.
>be faceless void >mfw I have no face
/Facepalm
How about allow mines to be placed on beacons normally, but don't allow them to capture? It would mean a lot more trigger work, but it's doable.
Red classic.
"In short, their absurdities are so extreme that it is painful even to quote them."
ShredderIV
lil-Inferno
