The best meleers at SEN are D+. 5 years ago, the most active members may have hit C-. C- is a requirment for standard clans like LzH, etc. You will find that people will give advice who don't play sc anymore.

Other
54,057 posts...Really?!?!?...47% of the entire site's activity...There are countless forums which are non-sc related.

Clan Oo
Clan Chef
SEN used to have an activity standard. 99% of the time you would not find someone in their channels or op sen. Better yet, they are dead clans. There forums are pointless.

Database
This database sucks. Not easy to upload. Noone would submit maps other than their own.

Reviews
What is the point? Is this for people who don't have SC installed? By the time you read their 5 sentence paragraphs you could have seen the map for yourself.

Doodan
Status: Global Moderator
I personally hate this guy.
5 Reasons why I hate this guy
1)Horribly liberal
2)Horribly opininionated
3)Who the hell is he? Never seen him on b.net. I think he made a campaign 5 years ago?
4)Witch hunt moar plz?
5)Sen Survivor
6)His Poetry

Lawl, i like the 17 posts in the "Use Map Settings" 4 forums. 19 posts related to the game...
Jack of all trades status: No

Even for a forum moderator, where SC activity is not required, this guy sucks.


DLDB
Active submitters are a must. Rewards should be given for people who contribute to the DLDB. The DLDB moderators hardly do anything. You should give DLDB moderatorship for the top 3-5 who submit the most files.

Conclusion:
I will conclude my argument with a quote from this beloved G.M.
This site has many things wrong that simply could be fixed.
Its staff hardly play SC and I wouldn't be suprised if some didn't have the game installed.
You should hire news writers to post news. Example: SC batches, new ladders, new programs

Wiki
This needs to have a SC General section. Many good topics could be covered.

Articles
This is a must have. If you look at any good site you will find this. You can make an article section or a featured threads section. There should be incentives to encourage people to write SC related articles. Possibly, a spot on the news portal for the most current 10 article names. Other sites provide a wealth of knowledge to readers. Interesting articles and experiments could be written about map concepts, mod concepts, melee tricks, melee strats, ladders, Marijuanna affecting SC, SC Beta, SC2, popular channels, other sites, files, Build orders, most played maps, map genres, etc. The most widely used forums for Dune 2, a game 20 years old, has a classic forum for featured threads -.-.

Site Projects
This is a must have. If you look at any good site you will find this. There should be site projects such as a monthly or seasonal site map such as a quilt bound, defense map, micro map, or minigame map where people could work together and contribute unique levels to. What better project to kick off the new year's than SC2 to SC1 mod where you attempt to make a SC1 mod with all of the SC2 possible units?

Discussion Topics
Topics for community discussion. Examples include 2009 site suggestions, sc2 ideas, sc2 4th race ideas, moderator sugestions.

The purpose of this site should be to share veterans' wealth of knowledge, community projects, and sharing files. Hopefully, I've listed some ideas that may be changed by new year's day. You should actively seek out community leaders to help run out the site. Find decent sc players to give advice. Find the guys who play in bound clans to submit their 10k bounds to are dldb. Find the guys who play RPGs to submit 1000 rpgs to the site. Give 'em moderatorship.

First of all...
are you talking about ICCup (d, d-, c+)?
and why the heck do you think that [ ]: is dead?
also...

Doodan
Status: Global Moderator
I personally hate this guy.
5 Reasons why I hate this guy
1)Horribly liberal
2)Horribly opininionated
3)Who the hell is he? Never seen him on b.net. I think he made a campaign 5 years ago?
4)Witch hunt moar plz?
5)Sen Survivor
6)His Poetry

3) He's a nice guy and moderator for SEN [he makes a great job (even if I hated him for some days, too)]
5) This is an awesome game


database.. it's actually not the best database, but it either doesn't sucks.

Review is a good option which I love! this shows other members good maps (you can write your statement to a map in reviews) [by the way... the recently reviewd is bugged since one of the staff recreated the table for it]

Wiki: this is a mapper/modder-page also "normal" gamers can come, but the wiki is for supporting mappers/modders


Discussion Topics
Topics for community discussion. Examples include 2009 site suggestions, sc2 ideas, sc2 4th race ideas, moderator sugestions.
The Forum on SEN is one of the best forum's I've ever seen. There is a SC2 Forum... make a topic there if you want.


My feedback to you: If you don't like SEN, you don't need to visit it...
EDIT: you joined 30-40 minutes ago... lol... you should not be able to give such a feedback

CheF is dead?

One, Doodan is my favorite moderator, Two, It is very easy to upload maps and things when you actually try to, Three, The wiki basically covers everything SC, did you forget to open your eyes? Four, His poetry isn't really that bad, Five, SEN Survivor is awesome even though I haven't played it, only read. Six, I can agree a few things can be fixed, and final, if you hate this place so much, why waste your time on it?

Lol that's 6 reasons. l2count?

"I personally hate this guy"

Yeah, that didn't sound pretty much like the constructive criticism I expected from a member that joined 30 minutes before posting this thread. Oh wait...!

I don't tell people where to post. Should I delete people's posts in Other and say "you know, you don't post enough in the SC-related areas"?

I can understand about oO which had a whopping 1 active topic in the past month... but not really so much for Chef.

Any suggestions for improvement?

Re: Doodan
I don't recall ever claiming that our Global Moderators where proficient with or even fully knowledgable in (a "jack of all trades", as you say) all areas of StarCraft.

How do you know?

I really don't think people should be rewarded for uploading their entire downloads directory. Most of the maps would probably be crap.

Anyone can post news for approval. Even you.

One of the basic principles of the Wiki is that anyone can create and edit content. Even you.

We can infer that he wouldn't know this much to make these criticisms if he hasn't been lurking without registering or posting for quite some time.

I bet its a double account that hates doodan GET EM MOOSE

GOGO MOOSE
by the way: "chef is dead" o rly? three chef members has replied this post (3 of 7 posts!)...
dead is something else, isn't it?


anyway: good question, what happend with Oo.oO ?

So Ix has had an account here for an hour and he already has an alarmingly vast knowledge about SEN. It's quite clear that you've been around here for awhile to see all that's been going on and making you feel upset. Why don't you step forward with the identity that we are more familiar with? Using an alt to do this is rather cowardly if you ask me. I, personally, am not shy about coming forward with my opinions and assuming whatever risk is involved to my well being in doing so.

That tends to happen at a site that focuses on UMS. We certainly welcome and accommodate melee players, but since that area is not the site's specialty, it shouldn't come as such a shock that we aren't up to our eyeballs in proficient melee players.

That's really not the staff's fault. Sure, many of us don't play Starcraft ALL THE TIME, so the Other forum is a way to stay in touch with your online friends even though they've grown tired of playing the same game all the time.

I don't monitor the Clan forums enough to give an informed opinion.

Why don't you help that problem by uploading some of your favorite maps that you didn't make?

Some games take hours to fully appreciate. A good review will let them know if it is worth that much time. Also, as a creator, I love taking in intelligent criticism from a well made review.

Hehehe

First, learn to count.

1) That's a laugh. I admit that I lean to the left a little, but my more liberal friends think of me as conservative. I don't go OMOMG BUSH SUX! or MCCAIN AND PALIN WILL RUIN THIS COUNTRY OMG!! or OBAMA FOR GOOODDD!! You must be ultra-conservative if I come off as extremely liberal. Even if I were, the important thing is that I keep my politics out of my moderation.

2) I can be. Aren't you, though? I need to be able to exercise judgment to do my job.

3) I'm a SEN regular. I know a lot of people here. I like this place. I am willing to give some time to this place free of charge. I don't go on Bnet that often. I admit that I don't play starcraft that much these days. If it makes you feel better though, after New Years, I am planning to use my last 2 weeks of winter break to make a final SC campaign before SC2 comes out.

4) When have I ever started or participated in a "witch hunt"? Give me an example.

5) I don't see you hating on any other staff member that hosts forum games. What's so bad about Survivor, specifically? Did you keep getting voted off with your other account? People at a forum with a focus also need time to unwind. A group of college students don't spend ALL of their time studying, do they? You also seem to forget that it's the only major forum game that encourages its contestants to play SC.

6) Haha, why not give me some constructive feedback in my topics? I like to hear from everyone, even those who don't like my stuff. FIRE HIM CUZ HIS POETRY SUCKS LOL!

When members have a problem with a post they see, they report it and I take a look. The areas that I'm not terribly active also tend to have low rates of reports.


I have to leave in a few minutes... Let me say, in closing, that I agree with what Moose said about the remaining categories. As to seeking staff from outside the site (or those that join just to submit maps), I've been a mod at other forums, and bringing a total outsider into a large forum rarely works. They don't know anyone and they don't know the history, so it's hard for them to instantly care about a mod job at a foreign forum. Also, being a good map maker does not, alone, qualify someone for the socially conscious job of being a moderator.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Dec 17 2008, 7:37 pm by Doodan.

If your looking for a real melee community you've came to the wrong place.


Probably the only time during this reply ill agree with you


LOL fuck no it isn't but maybe 20+ active member clan is dead to you but CheF is basically the only mapmaking clan that can say this currently.


The database is easy to upload with if you're not retarded.


By the time you load sc and logged onto b.net you could have easily read the 5 sentences and decided if the map is for you, unless you have a first grade reading level.


These maps never end up working, they have been tried before.


This could be a security risk to the site, Moderators have to be hand selected to insure they will do their job and not just submit a lot of maps in order to mess with the site.

My overall opinion on you: If you don't like SEN get the fuck out.

One of the first things you learn when you come to SEN is that the majority of the regulars here barely have anything to do with mapping. Some don't even play the game anymore. Some would even say the entire non-SC related sections are what keep SEN alive/active. One thing is for sure is that SENers love their Other section.

If SEN was focused on melee then that would be an issue. However, since it's not a big part of SEN it doesn't matter at all. People who are serious about melee probably should know better than to look here for serious melee advice anyway.

Total post statistics are useless. You don't have to look at the other non-sc related forums.

I agree these forums are pretty pointless, but it doesn't matter that they're there. I just don't even look at them. There aren't even any active mapmaking clans in all of SC left anyway.

It doesn't even really matter if people don't submit maps other than their own. It's still a database and it's still easy to download from.

There's already a topic about this. Right now it's inactive and it could be argued that it's pointless, but it doesn't matter. Just don't look at that section if you don't like it.

Hate is a strong word and I find it pretty sad that you hate a guy when he hasn't even done anything to you directly. What's funny is he doesn't even know who you are and doesn't give a shit about you.

And your reasons for hating him are purely personal.

Not at all. He's good at what he does which is moderating the other sections. He may not have the expertise to always give advice in the mapmaking forums, but he can certainly do his job handling people who spam and do other things against the rules.

Moderators only need to enforce the rules. If you take a look at the rules most of the rules are not specific to SC. They're general forum rules that can apply anywhere.

Being an active submitter doesn't mean you should be a moderator. Those are two different things. The DLDB staff has their own private subforum that you can see. They work behind the scenes in the background which is why you can't tell that they're doing things, but they are certainly there doing their job.

I don't see why you're quoting Doodan. What he says is true. All you have done is quote him but you have said how it is relevant to your argument. I don't know whether you're agreeing with the quote or disagreeing with it or what, because you haven't said so.

Anyway about what you have said. The staff does play SC. Moose plays SC frequently and so does IP. But it doesn't even matter if they did play SC. Staff are just needed to make sure the site runs properly and to moderate. The majority of that work isn't related to SC.

It is a wiki. You're welcome to write an article.

Once again you're free to write an article. No one is going to stop you. Make a thread or put it in the wiki. If there's enough interest to warrant an articles section then one could be created.

There are contests that are held and anyone can start their own contest or tournament or anything that involves the community. However, an SEN map project has been attempted in the past and it died, but you're welcome to try and start one again. The point is that there's nothing to stop you from doing any of those things.

This is a forum. The whole place is meant for discussion. Just create a topic in the right forum and it will be discussed by the community.

There's a difference between having a purpose and fulfilling that purpose. SEN may not be fulfilling what you want it to but the problem is the community as a whole. You can point out all of the flaws, but you also should take the initiative to start some change by doing things yourself. No one is stopping you. IP has provided a site where all these things can be done. If they haven't been done then its because no one has taken advantage of all the things the site can offer.

The site runs fine.

SEN has plenty of knowledgeable mapmakers that give plenty of advice. SEN isn't out to become the source for melee knowledge or things outside of mapmaking.

There are people who are already uploading the maps in their download folder, but you're welcome to go find those people yourself. Anyone can upload to the site, the staff shouldn't have to go around begging people to upload and they certainly shouldn't need to give people incentives like staff positions. Moderatorship has nothing to do with uploading maps. Clearly you have no idea what moderators do.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Dec 17 2008, 8:09 pm by Mayor.

I could pick apart most of your post and counter most of the things you say, but you're probably just a troll. So instead, you get this:


NO U

YEA Nice "NO-U Cycle" I saved that image, it makes me crazy lol

EDIT: I just noticed that this is an useless//spam post... so I'll attach a message...
clan CheF isn't dead!

if a mod still thinks that this post should be deleted, please do so...

In his 5 reasons he hates Doodan (6 if you can count LOL) the number 4 reason uses the word 'moar'. After my days of mafia playing, Its time we analyze the clues and track this sun of a besh down xD I know I use the word moar, but Im DEFENTLY not the only one. Who else says it?

Could it be evildesk in disguise?
Or Dazed... sounds kinda like dazed...

dazed can Engrish much better than this guy.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Dec 18 2008, 12:19 am by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Flaming

This is moar funny then I thought it would be. Anyway, failpost is fail. Longpost is long. Badmember is bad. Yada yada.

He's criticizing based on personal opinions, ranting about why this website isn't pure SC, etc. If we followed that little genius's advice, this would certainly not be the SEN we know and love.

lx~, you bring up some intelligent and constructively negative points, but there is not one that cannot be corrected by community support and activity.

Melee: We're a UMS-focused website, silly.

Other: As has been mentioned by my fellow forum-ers, this point is irrelevant -- these forums are lenient towards the content of posts. Notice the forums "Serious Discussion'' and "Media, Art, and Literature": they don't pertain to Starcraft, do they?

Clans: Even though they are no longer the 'hot spot' that they once were, they still contain valuable information on (starcraft-wise) fairly to highly active clans that can help potential recruitees. Who gives a flying fuck about whether or not they are frequently traversed? I could see checking up on clan members to see if they utilize the rest of the site, but to deem them unnecessary and unworthy... blasphemy.

Database: I agree -- the system is not perfect. However, the quality of the system is dictated by the actions of the community, and if you honestly were interested in the bringing-about of a better database, you would have submitted or edited maps.

Reviews: refer to Doodan's post.

Doodan: Highly opinionated, personalized, un-true and hateful dislikes. Stay around for a few weeks, and you'll see that Doodan is an extremely efficient and helpful moderator.


Yes. No. No, completely untrue. No.

Conclusion?: True, and many of your ideas are viable in an idealized, 'perfect' form. Oh, and if we had three times the members writing positions would be more plausible.

Wiki: Have you looked at our Wiki?

Articles: Yes, an active articles highly on the portal would be useful... but incentives to write good articles? Mhmmm.. what does pinning topics denote?

Site Projects: If you were a frequent visitor to this site, you would know that there have been many community projects in the past. Unfortunately, not all of them have been finished.

Discussion Topics: This is a forum. Looking for a place to submit ideas?: UMS Theories & Ideas, for one, seems to have that exact purpose for mapping.


In any case, if you truly believe the suggestions that you are making, reply and defend yourself. You can't endorse something unless you truly and wholly believe in it.

I honestly agree with a lot of this, although the Doodan thing is a bit off, since as you pointed out, a lot of the site is non-SC related, so we need a good global moderator to run that half of it.


Ahem.


Ahem. Although, since that was against Doodan, I better say something else, but it's basically the same reason as before, he's good at keeping the non-SC sections clean, and the SC ones too. You may not have seen him years back when SeN started, but he's an elite now, and while he's sorta retired from SC, all of his stats from old versions of SeN are gone, so he also loses his posts there.

Not to mention, this version of SeN is a work in progress, constructive criticism is nice, but this is just negative, if you want to see it fixed, post how you would rather have it, and there's a good chance it will be done.

I agree with you in some aspects, and the 49% Other is a pretty ridiculous, but it doesn't affect you much, and we can't really help it. StarCraft is waning, and with the shadow of SC2 over it, it's getting even worse, this site used to be a lot more active in SC, and you can expect a big upswing when SC2 comes out, we're just in a bit of a ditch right now during this transition.