Oooooo looks sexy man!

Oooooo looks sexy man!

[quote=Tazzy][IMG]http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x312/Taz0Snip/4PerfectRISE.jpg[/IMG] Any better?[/quote] -all your decoration is symmetrical, the symmetry tool is to be used for map layout, but you never do details with it -naturals are in a position that Zerg can't defend FE from, you need to move them near the choke point -the chokes at the mains are too wide -seems like there's a little too many minerals on this map -mains are far bigger than they need to be, 2/3 that size would be plenty -all minerals on the map are type 3, need to make more variety -more doodads It's coming along.

Quote from Tazzy

Any better?

-all your decoration is symmetrical, the symmetry tool is to be used for map layout, but you never do details with it
-naturals are in a position that Zerg can't defend FE from, you need to move them near the choke point
-the chokes at the mains are too wide
-seems like there's a little too many minerals on this map
-mains are far bigger than they need to be, 2/3 that size would be plenty
-all minerals on the map are type 3, need to make more variety
-more doodads

It's coming along.

I think it pwns. Disclaimer: The preceding was an exaggeration, but it's still pretty cool.

I think it pwns.

Disclaimer: The preceding was an exaggeration, but it's still pretty cool.

It looks like a fun map. I'd play it. But wouldn't tanks own the middle?

It looks like a fun map. I'd play it.

But wouldn't tanks own the middle?

And isn't that what developing strategies on Melee maps is about? Da dur da dur.

And isn't that what developing strategies on Melee maps is about?


Da dur da dur.

Well, yeah, I guess...

Well, yeah, I guess...

[quote=friedleaves]Well, yeah, I guess...[/quote] Nono, don't back down. You were right (Kellimus is against any and all changes to this map suggested by mappers who actually know what they are talking about). Tanks will still have a slight advantage in the center, but at the same time, there are ways around it and air could be powerful on this map so Tazzy can change it if he wants to, won't make too big of a difference.

Quote from friedleaves

Well, yeah, I guess...

Nono, don't back down. You were right (Kellimus is against any and all changes to this map suggested by mappers who actually know what they are talking about). Tanks will still have a slight advantage in the center, but at the same time, there are ways around it and air could be powerful on this map so Tazzy can change it if he wants to, won't make too big of a difference.

Guess I'm slowly learning who's who in SEN :}. Hopefully Kellimus doesn't start another pointless argument after you said that one bit. If no one has a problem with the middle, then I have no other problems with the map that weren't already stated. It does seem kinda straightforward, though.

Guess I'm slowly learning who's who in SEN . Hopefully Kellimus doesn't start another pointless argument after you said that one bit.

If no one has a problem with the middle, then I have no other problems with the map that weren't already stated. It does seem kinda straightforward, though.

Agreed, maybe you could break up the middle into several different ramps. The back ramps are good, but it almost looks blocky because it's so straight.

Agreed, maybe you could break up the middle into several different ramps. The back ramps are good, but it almost looks blocky because it's so straight.

[quote=TitanWing]Nono, don't back down. You were right (Kellimus is against any and all changes to this map suggested by mappers who actually know what they are talking about). Tanks will still have a slight advantage in the center, but at the same time, there are ways around it and air could be powerful on this map so Tazzy can change it if he wants to, won't make too big of a difference.[/quote] [quote=friedleaves]Guess I'm slowly learning who's who in SEN . Hopefully Kellimus doesn't start another pointless argument after you said that one bit.[/quote] Damn. Since when did Trolls travel in packs? Anyways, I think the map is fine how it is Tazzy. If tanks "could pwn the middle", isn't that fine? I truely believe that map making is about what [i]you[/i] want, not what others want.. You've applied some of their "wants" into your map, so why not leave it how it is, and release it? Any good meleer would develop a strategy against the "tank pwning the middle", and you know this. So I guess what I'm trying to say is: TitanWing, why don't you be quiet for once, and try to quit trolling people who have a different opinion than you, m'kay? And sorry, but you [i]don't[/i] know everything so if I were wise, I'd keep that mentality on the D/L. Just because I believe in working hard for something instead of making it so simple doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, m'kay? Meaning (cause I know I have to spell it out for everyone here on the glorious se.n) that just because something isn't the way [i]you[/i] want it on a map, doesn't make it bad, wrong, or a stupid thing. I consider Tazzy's maps (from what they used to be, no offence mang) to be very well made. So please, stop with the Trolling cause its pretty old, and pretty pathetic.

Quote from TitanWing

Nono, don't back down. You were right (Kellimus is against any and all changes to this map suggested by mappers who actually know what they are talking about). Tanks will still have a slight advantage in the center, but at the same time, there are ways around it and air could be powerful on this map so Tazzy can change it if he wants to, won't make too big of a difference.

Quote from friedleaves

Guess I'm slowly learning who's who in SEN . Hopefully Kellimus doesn't start another pointless argument after you said that one bit.

Damn. Since when did Trolls travel in packs?

Anyways, I think the map is fine how it is Tazzy. If tanks "could pwn the middle", isn't that fine?

I truely believe that map making is about what you want, not what others want.. You've applied some of their "wants" into your map, so why not leave it how it is, and release it?

Any good meleer would develop a strategy against the "tank pwning the middle", and you know this.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is: TitanWing, why don't you be quiet for once, and try to quit trolling people who have a different opinion than you, m'kay? And sorry, but you don't know everything so if I were wise, I'd keep that mentality on the D/L. Just because I believe in working hard for something instead of making it so simple doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, m'kay? Meaning (cause I know I have to spell it out for everyone here on the glorious se.n) that just because something isn't the way you want it on a map, doesn't make it bad, wrong, or a stupid thing.

I consider Tazzy's maps (from what they used to be, no offence mang) to be very well made.

So please, stop with the Trolling cause its pretty old, and pretty pathetic.

Guess my hopes have just been crushed... Please, if what I said is considered trolling, I apologize, and I don't want to start another pointless argument. I see your views perfectly logical, I just have other opinions, so I decided to share them. They may be right, they may be wrong. I just don't want this thread to fire up again. Anyways, Tazzy, waiting for an update. I'm excited to see how you're going to change things with your map.

Guess my hopes have just been crushed...

Please, if what I said is considered trolling, I apologize, and I don't want to start another pointless argument. I see your views perfectly logical, I just have other opinions, so I decided to share them. They may be right, they may be wrong. I just don't want this thread to fire up again.

Anyways, Tazzy, waiting for an update. I'm excited to see how you're going to change things with your map.

[quote=Kellimus]So I guess what I'm trying to say is: TitanWing, why don't you be quiet for once, and try to quit trolling people who have a different opinion than you, m'kay? And sorry, but you [i]don't[/i] know everything so if I were wise, I'd keep that mentality on the D/L. Just because I believe in working hard for something instead of making it so simple doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, m'kay? Meaning (cause I know I have to spell it out for everyone here on the glorious se.n) that just because something isn't the way [i]you[/i] want it on a map, doesn't make it bad, wrong, or a stupid thing. I consider Tazzy's maps (from what they used to be, no offence mang) to be very well made. So please, stop with the Trolling cause its pretty old, and pretty pathetic.[/quote]Hm...I'm terribly sorry you are offended, but maybe you should stop being...I don't know...wrong all the time? Nothing you say helps Tazzy get any better at mapping, and in fact is detrimental because you are suggesting that if a map has an imbalance, the players at the disadvantage should just suck it up and be happily beaten because the map was unfair. Wrong. You are not a melee mapper, you are not a melee player (at least not decent enough to be of use to Tazzy judging from what I hear each time you post). As such, it is not I, but rather yourself who is trolling. Now, quit turning all of my advice to Tazzy into a poorly constructed spark to a flame war and either pack your bags or offer helpful advice and ESPECIALLY stop countering the advice of those who actually know what they are doing with some half-assed bullshit. I've been making melee maps for the better part of five years, so I'll gladly submit to your wisdom if you have more experience (or maturity in general). How can you say "stop the trolling" while making a big argument for the singular purpose of rousing a violent response from me?

Quote from Kellimus

So I guess what I'm trying to say is: TitanWing, why don't you be quiet for once, and try to quit trolling people who have a different opinion than you, m'kay? And sorry, but you don't know everything so if I were wise, I'd keep that mentality on the D/L. Just because I believe in working hard for something instead of making it so simple doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, m'kay? Meaning (cause I know I have to spell it out for everyone here on the glorious se.n) that just because something isn't the way you want it on a map, doesn't make it bad, wrong, or a stupid thing.

I consider Tazzy's maps (from what they used to be, no offence mang) to be very well made.

So please, stop with the Trolling cause its pretty old, and pretty pathetic.

Hm...I'm terribly sorry you are offended, but maybe you should stop being...I don't know...wrong all the time? Nothing you say helps Tazzy get any better at mapping, and in fact is detrimental because you are suggesting that if a map has an imbalance, the players at the disadvantage should just suck it up and be happily beaten because the map was unfair. Wrong.

You are not a melee mapper, you are not a melee player (at least not decent enough to be of use to Tazzy judging from what I hear each time you post). As such, it is not I, but rather yourself who is trolling. Now, quit turning all of my advice to Tazzy into a poorly constructed spark to a flame war and either pack your bags or offer helpful advice and ESPECIALLY stop countering the advice of those who actually know what they are doing with some half-assed bullshit.

I've been making melee maps for the better part of five years, so I'll gladly submit to your wisdom if you have more experience (or maturity in general). How can you say "stop the trolling" while making a big argument for the singular purpose of rousing a violent response from me?

Wow friedleaves, you really called that one. But hey, you jinxed it. Anyway, Tazzy, to clarify on my original point... It seems to me that the back ramp may be well smoothed, but the problem is it's too unnatural. I know terrain isn't really huge in melee maps, but try to throw in some doodads if nothing else. Trees would be nice. Also, grass terrain does not affect the gameplay, so it may be a good idea to lose the grass symmetry in favor of eye pleasingness. As I said earlier, breaking up the huge back ramp (and perhaps the front ramps for symmetry) would be a nice way to avoid the plainness, and could be expanded on by throwing doodads in between. Main point: Break up the middle a bit, be decorative. See if you can break up symmetry without compromising the balanced nature of the map.

Wow friedleaves, you really called that one. But hey, you jinxed it.

Anyway, Tazzy, to clarify on my original point...
It seems to me that the back ramp may be well smoothed, but the problem is it's too unnatural. I know terrain isn't really huge in melee maps, but try to throw in some doodads if nothing else. Trees would be nice. Also, grass terrain does not affect the gameplay, so it may be a good idea to lose the grass symmetry in favor of eye pleasingness.
As I said earlier, breaking up the huge back ramp (and perhaps the front ramps for symmetry) would be a nice way to avoid the plainness, and could be expanded on by throwing doodads in between.
Main point: Break up the middle a bit, be decorative. See if you can break up symmetry without compromising the balanced nature of the map.

[quote=TitanWing][quote=Kellimus]So I guess what I'm trying to say is: TitanWing, why don't you be quiet for once, and try to quit trolling people who have a different opinion than you, m'kay? And sorry, but you [i]don't[/i] know everything so if I were wise, I'd keep that mentality on the D/L. Just because I believe in working hard for something instead of making it so simple doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, m'kay? Meaning (cause I know I have to spell it out for everyone here on the glorious se.n) that just because something isn't the way [i]you[/i] want it on a map, doesn't make it bad, wrong, or a stupid thing. I consider Tazzy's maps (from what they used to be, no offence mang) to be very well made. So please, stop with the Trolling cause its pretty old, and pretty pathetic.[/quote]Hm...I'm terribly sorry you are offended, but maybe you should stop being...I don't know...wrong all the time? Nothing you say helps Tazzy get any better at mapping, and in fact is detrimental because you are suggesting that if a map has an imbalance, the players at the disadvantage should just suck it up and be happily beaten because the map was unfair. Wrong. You are not a melee mapper, you are not a melee player (at least not decent enough to be of use to Tazzy judging from what I hear each time you post). As such, it is not I, but rather yourself who is trolling. Now, quit turning all of my advice to Tazzy into a poorly constructed spark to a flame war and either pack your bags or offer helpful advice and ESPECIALLY stop countering the advice of those who actually know what they are doing with some half-assed bullshit. I've been making melee maps for the better part of five years, so I'll gladly submit to your wisdom if you have more experience (or maturity in general). How can you say "stop the trolling" while making a big argument for the singular purpose of rousing a violent response from me?[/quote] Is all you can do, insult people? That's pretty pathetic, honestly. Just because I don't melee on Battle.net or anything like that, doesn't mean I'm not a meleer. I just love to read how you think you know every single thing about me, and you've never even met me. Keep up with the off-topic trolling man! :D Btw: I'm making an argument for the singular purpose of rousing voilent responses from you? If you cant handle my opinions and you attack me violently because of them, you shouldn't even be in here in the first place. You speak of maturity, yet you're the one (along with Frazz) that is constantly attacking me because I have an opinion for someone who is my [i]friend[/i]. Thats really "mature" Daniel: You should close this thread honestly, because people like TitanWing just love to get off topic and attack people who have a different opinion than them. This thread has served its purpose in showing you how you need/should fix your map, so you should just close it before TitanWing comes back in here and keeps flaming me because I don't play Melee online like he does, or because he lets himself get so "angered" over an opinion (which I'm entitled to on this site) that I dish out to, oh wait a minute: YOU This is so hillarious how they're all trying to blame me, don't you think Daniel? :lol:

Quote from TitanWing

Quote from Kellimus

So I guess what I'm trying to say is: TitanWing, why don't you be quiet for once, and try to quit trolling people who have a different opinion than you, m'kay? And sorry, but you don't know everything so if I were wise, I'd keep that mentality on the D/L. Just because I believe in working hard for something instead of making it so simple doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, m'kay? Meaning (cause I know I have to spell it out for everyone here on the glorious se.n) that just because something isn't the way you want it on a map, doesn't make it bad, wrong, or a stupid thing.

I consider Tazzy's maps (from what they used to be, no offence mang) to be very well made.

So please, stop with the Trolling cause its pretty old, and pretty pathetic.

Hm...I'm terribly sorry you are offended, but maybe you should stop being...I don't know...wrong all the time? Nothing you say helps Tazzy get any better at mapping, and in fact is detrimental because you are suggesting that if a map has an imbalance, the players at the disadvantage should just suck it up and be happily beaten because the map was unfair. Wrong.

You are not a melee mapper, you are not a melee player (at least not decent enough to be of use to Tazzy judging from what I hear each time you post). As such, it is not I, but rather yourself who is trolling. Now, quit turning all of my advice to Tazzy into a poorly constructed spark to a flame war and either pack your bags or offer helpful advice and ESPECIALLY stop countering the advice of those who actually know what they are doing with some half-assed bullshit.

I've been making melee maps for the better part of five years, so I'll gladly submit to your wisdom if you have more experience (or maturity in general). How can you say "stop the trolling" while making a big argument for the singular purpose of rousing a violent response from me?

Is all you can do, insult people?

That's pretty pathetic, honestly.

Just because I don't melee on Battle.net or anything like that, doesn't mean I'm not a meleer. I just love to read how you think you know every single thing about me, and you've never even met me.

Keep up with the off-topic trolling man!

Btw: I'm making an argument for the singular purpose of rousing voilent responses from you?

If you cant handle my opinions and you attack me violently because of them, you shouldn't even be in here in the first place. You speak of maturity, yet you're the one (along with Frazz) that is constantly attacking me because I have an opinion for someone who is my friend.

Thats really "mature"

Daniel: You should close this thread honestly, because people like TitanWing just love to get off topic and attack people who have a different opinion than them. This thread has served its purpose in showing you how you need/should fix your map, so you should just close it before TitanWing comes back in here and keeps flaming me because I don't play Melee online like he does, or because he lets himself get so "angered" over an opinion (which I'm entitled to on this site) that I dish out to, oh wait a minute: YOU

This is so hillarious how they're all trying to blame me, don't you think Daniel?

If this continues, I'll just craw into my little hole until this is over... I DID say that I apologized, if that is any help, and I'm sure Titan would too. I don't recall blaming you for anything, but if I did, I'm sorry for that too. Please, let's just get back on topic. Forget this happened. Kellimus, you're right. Titan, you're right. Let's just leave it at that. No more about this. About the map: I'd have to agree with Frazz on his last post. A few trees in the middle areas would be very nice. I'm not so sure about breaking up the ramps, though, but I see your point.

If this continues, I'll just craw into my little hole until this is over...

I DID say that I apologized, if that is any help, and I'm sure Titan would too. I don't recall blaming you for anything, but if I did, I'm sorry for that too.

Please, let's just get back on topic. Forget this happened. Kellimus, you're right. Titan, you're right. Let's just leave it at that. No more about this.

About the map: I'd have to agree with Frazz on his last post. A few trees in the middle areas would be very nice. I'm not so sure about breaking up the ramps, though, but I see your point.

/ignore further hypocritical bullshit from Kellimus GGNORE

/ignore further hypocritical bullshit from Kellimus

GGNORE

Kids, are we done?

Kids, are we done?

[quote=devilesk][quote=Mini Moose 2707]Kids, are we done?[/quote] NO, MOMMY! NO![/quote] Cute.

Quote from devilesk

Quote from Mini Moose 2707

Kids, are we done?

NO, MOMMY! NO!

Cute.

Wow lots of argueing! Anyways, the map looks nice. Ill be waiting for an update!

Wow lots of argueing! Anyways, the map looks nice. Ill be waiting for an update!

No worries friedleaves. I'll edit/delete any FURTHER post(s) not pertaining to the issue (The wrong-doer may even get a mineral penatly? :omfg: ). This is not the place for that argument. Consider this a warning, everyone.

No worries friedleaves. I'll edit/delete any FURTHER post(s) not pertaining to the issue (The wrong-doer may even get a mineral penatly? ). This is not the place for that argument. Consider this a warning, everyone.