Staredit Network > Forums > SC1 UMS Theory and Ideas > Topic: Doubly Protecting Maps without EUDS
Doubly Protecting Maps without EUDS
Aug 5 2009, 10:26 pm
By: Madroc
Pages: 1 2 3 >
 

Aug 5 2009, 10:26 pm Madroc Post #1



Making UMS maps is one of the most rewarding and fun things to do. Mapmakers spend hours or even days on end working on maps. But a map can be hurt and its mapmaker defamed if the map gets into the hands of someone just lazy and unethical enough to change the map. Map protectors have been created, but an equal amount of map unprotectors have been created. Additional measures need to be taken if the mapmaker wishes his efforts to have been worthwhile.

The way I suggest to protect your map (in addition to the regular protectors) is to enmesh triggers that completely screw up the map if a particular system is changed. In order to outsmart a clever mapstealer who has access to notepad and its handy dandy search function, the enmeshed triggers need to be disguised as other triggers. If they are disguised properly, the mapstealer would have to know as much or more about the map than the mapmaker does, as well as go through every single trigger and try to understand if, for example, setting a death count to a certain value will wreck a system or is actually a necessary part of the system. If done properly and in enough places, it could take hundreds of hours for the mapstealer to unprotect a system and very likely he will give up.

Inscribing the Mapmaker's Name
One example of how to protect a system.
Putting a name on a map is important, for fame and recognition cannot be achieved without it. Unfortunately, there is a little program called Notepad. Using me as an example, all a person has to do is search for the name "madroc" and replace all instances of it with "xXxmapstealer1333337XxX" and suddenly he created the map, not me.

The foolproof way that I suggest here would be to inscribe your name into the map using zerglings, and then enmesh defeat triggers and other horrible death counts and things if there zerglings are not in their right places. Here is how (i'll give specifics but really you need to try to think of how this works for YOUR map).

Let's say you have a death count timer that the map must have to operate correctly. Let's say it counts down from 20 to 0 and starts over. Many intricate maps have this, and if yours doesn't, don't worry, read on (you undoubtedly have many many things that would work besides this). Now here is where your name is inscribed (try to make it a place that players have to look at at some point in the game):

Let's also say that the 3x3 movable location is also being used elsewhere in the map, for example always being centered on a unit or something of that nature. Many maps have these to save locations. But if yours doesn't, it's not a big deal; all this does is make it harder for the mapstealer to steal. Read on.

Then, all throughout your existing triggers, hidden, have triggers (traps) that, if the death count timer is at a certain number (so that it doesn't do this every cycle which could cause lag), cycles through a certain number of zerglings using "give units," (lets say three, but it should be a different number for each trap) and then centers the 3x3 location on the next one (locations and give units always affect the leftmost unit in a location). Check to see how many zerglings are there by testing before you actually implement this trigger into your map, and then implement a trigger that sees if there are that many zerglings there. If there are, then you know the mapstealer did not move or remove any of the zerglings close to that zergling and you can set a death count (disguised as an action that actually you need for the map) or something else (also disguised) and then later on, set a death count (also disguised) in your map to something nasty that will screw up something if the death count is not at the right number, or something similar. It's important that you set something awry that will not arouse suspicion from a mapstealer, but it could be anything from a death count, to killing a specific unit, to creating a unit.. it all depends on what really screws up your map. Just make it disguised as something that the map actually needs.

Doing just that might not work because the mapstealer could easily use the search function in notepad to find "zergling" and replace all those conditions with "always" and then be able to remove your name and the condition will always happen, and thus no consequence will happen. So have a third or so of the traps be fake traps, disguised the same way as the other triggers. For fake traps, detect if there are the WRONG number of zerglings there (like 5 when there are actually 4), and if there are, set a (disguised) death count (or something), and if the death count IS at the right number, do something horrible. That way, if the mapstealer just replaces it with always, something will be ruined (in fact the trigger does nothing at all because the conditions are NEVER met, but when they are met, something horrible happens).

Also, if the mapstealer tries to delete the 3x3 location, not only will some of the fake traps be set off, but whatever the 3x3 location was being used for no longer functions.

Try to do as many as you can of traps an fake traps. If you do 30 total, there should be an extremely slim chance that the mapmaker could figure out how to take off your name. Simple maps with less than 250 triggers should probably do about 50 total of each of these, enmeshing the triggers with each other and just making a huge mess of the place. Just remember that the more enmeshing you have, the less chance all your work will have been for nothing. Just spend one day making those zerglings be the cross stitches in the pants of your map.

This should be the last thing to be done to a map, so as to avoid falling into your own trap. If you want, write down where you set your traps, so if you want to change the map later, you can. Just no one else.

Another note, try to vary the things that screw up your map, because the notepad's search function could find them much more easily if they were all "set death count x to 10." Try to have lots of different doom actions.

You can also extend this protection system to other systems besides your name.

Questions, comments, babbles of confusion welcome :)


Other methods of double protection from responses:

• Use SC Character Swap, which is a program that swaps out characters a-o (unconfirmed) for characters that look the same in starcraft, but not in editors. (Falkoner)

• Make a trigger with a comment "11 1 9 1 19". Each number corresponds with a letter, (in this case it obviously makes K A I A S). (Kaias)

• Post the original map with a topic on staredit.net
• Release demo versions so that there is more of a chance people will know it's yours
• Add your name and other information in multiple places about the map (Ahli)

• Don't even bother protecting because your it's not the product that counts, it's the process of getting there (Kaias) and you don't need to care about the risk of it getting stolen anyways. (Pariah + others)


Post has been edited 5 time(s), last time on Aug 6 2009, 6:38 am by Madroc. Reason: Finally figured out how not to flame



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Aug 5 2009, 10:32 pm Biophysicist Post #2



Clever. I suggest implementing this in BASW right away.



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Aug 5 2009, 10:35 pm Madroc Post #3



Thanks. You're a fast reader. We'll do it at the very end, so we don't fall into into our own traps ;)



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Aug 5 2009, 10:41 pm Demented Shaman Post #4



The fact that you're publicly discussing this method is counterproductive to your cause. You should be working on your map first. This topic only shows a lack of focus and dedication to mapmaking.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Aug 5 2009, 10:44 pm by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Flamin'



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Aug 5 2009, 10:47 pm Ahli Post #5

I do stuff and thingies... Try widening and reducing the number of small nooks and crannies to correct the problem.

my method in my mind:
1. Make a map that is already pretty far.
2. create a topic on SEN about it.
3. post some beta stages of the map along with bug fixing documentations or whatever. (not like Life2death, just translating a map by another mapmaker and claiming everything as your own work...)
4. do maptests with the unfinished map on bnet (original spreads, hosts would notice the difference)
5. support your map even after you thought you finished it (e.g. fixing all bugs, etc...) or it was stolen (hi speed[fast], I know how to ruin the game for all players in your stolen version :D I know my bugs)
6. host it yourself
7. add staredit.net & your name to the map in multiple places (forces is important)

my current map protection:
1. make a post on SEN
2. release demo versions
3. do something insane




Aug 5 2009, 10:55 pm Madroc Post #6



Quote from name:Pariah
The fact that you're publicly discussing this method is counterproductive to your cause. You should be working on your map first. This topic only shows a lack of focus and dedication to mapmaking.
I probably would not spend the effort to make a map without knowing I had protection beforehand. The reason I posted this is not for me and TZ's map but for the community..

Quote from Ahli
my method in my mind:
1. Make a map that is already pretty far.
2. create a topic on SEN about it.
3. post some beta stages of the map along with bug fixing documentations or whatever. (not like Life2death, just translating a map by another mapmaker and claiming everything as your own work...)
4. do maptests with the unfinished map on bnet (original spreads, hosts would notice the difference)
5. support your map even after you thought you finished it (e.g. fixing all bugs, etc...) or it was stolen (hi speed[fast], I know how to ruin the game for all players in your stolen version :D I know my bugs)
6. host it yourself
7. add staredit.net & your name to the map in multiple places (forces is important)

my current map protection:
1. make a post on SEN
2. release demo versions
3. do something insane
Not bad. Pretty nice :D But it's a little risky, the stealer could assert that he actually was the original mapmaker, and the other versions could become less popular. And then most people who never visit SEN would never know it was yours. And my way is fairly easy. I would recommend using both our protection methods if possible.



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Aug 5 2009, 10:59 pm Demented Shaman Post #7



Quote from Madroc
Quote from name:Pariah
The fact that you're publicly discussing this method is counterproductive to your cause. You should be working on your map first. This topic only shows a lack of focus and dedication to mapmaking.
I probably would not spend the effort to make a map without knowing I had protection beforehand. The reason I posted this is not for me and TZ's map but for the community..
Like I said before, the majority of the community has little use for this method. We should be helping mappers to finish maps instead of distracting them with things they shouldn't even be worrying about, such as what to do to stop a map stealer when there isn't even a finished map to steal.

Also, Ahli's method is more than enough to protect a map. Doing anything more is not worth the time. If a map is properly spread and people know about it at SEN, there's no reason to do anything more.

This is only for paranoid people obsessed with preserving their precious mapmaking credit. But I suppose it's their time to waste, assuming that they even finish a map that would make use of such a method.



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Aug 5 2009, 11:00 pm lil-Inferno Post #8

Just here for the pie

Quote from Ahli
my current map protection:
1. make a post on SEN
2. release demo versions
3. do something insane
Your methods of protection are making so many triggers that people can't open it :).




Aug 5 2009, 11:05 pm Madroc Post #9



Quote from name:Pariah
Like I said before, the majority of the community has little use for this method. We should be helping mappers to finish maps instead of distracting them with things they shouldn't even be worrying about, such as what to do to stop a map stealer when there isn't even a finished map to steal.

Also, Ahli's method is more than enough to protect a map. Doing anything more is not worth the time. If a map is properly spread and people know about it at SEN, there's no reason to do anything more.
I totally disagree. I think everyone should be interested in this, unless people are just mapmaking for practice, which I've never heard of. I've talked to quite a few people who were mad about their map being stolen. And I don't think that Ahli's is enough. It seems like my method takes less effort anyways.

Edit
Quote from lil-Inferno
Quote from Ahli
my current map protection:
1. make a post on SEN
2. release demo versions
3. do something insane
Your methods of protection are making so many triggers that people can't open it :).
Except for Ahli's, maybe :D




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Aug 5 2009, 11:07 pm Kaias Post #10



Or you can just protect maps with satisfaction.

If you're so paranoid about being able to prove you made a map you could do what I used to do, make a trigger with the comment, "11 1 9 1 19". Each number corresponds with a letter, (in this case it obviously makes K A I A S). Try explaining that kind of coincidence in a stolen map.



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Aug 5 2009, 11:14 pm Demented Shaman Post #11



Quote from Madroc
Quote from name:Pariah
Like I said before, the majority of the community has little use for this method. We should be helping mappers to finish maps instead of distracting them with things they shouldn't even be worrying about, such as what to do to stop a map stealer when there isn't even a finished map to steal.

Also, Ahli's method is more than enough to protect a map. Doing anything more is not worth the time. If a map is properly spread and people know about it at SEN, there's no reason to do anything more.
I totally disagree. I think everyone should be interested in this, unless people are just mapmaking for practice, which I've never heard of. I've talked to quite a few people who were mad about their map being stolen. And I don't think that Ahli's is enough. It seems like my method takes less effort anyways.
No, very few people would have a use for this. For this method to be useful the mapmaker would need a completed map, something few mapmakers have. Another thing is that they have to be paranoid enough to think this would actually be a beneficial use of their time.

Also, who are the people you've talked to that have had their map stolen? I'm sure those maps aren't being played regularly on battle.net and that no one really cares who made it. And I'm sure it isn't hard to host the original map yourself and let people download the real version.



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Aug 5 2009, 11:15 pm Madroc Post #12



Quote from Kaias
Or you can just protect maps with satisfaction.

If you're so paranoid about being able to prove you made a map you could do what I used to do, make a trigger with the comment, "11 1 9 1 19". Each number corresponds with a letter, (in this case it obviously makes K A I A S). Try explaining that kind of coincidence in a stolen map.
Well I would definitely spend some hours for the possibility of people recognizing my name. I'm not sure who wouldn't.

Don't you think that if the malicious map stealer doesn't recognize 11 1 9 1 19, then other people wouldn't either? It's far from foolproof.


Edit:
Quote from name:Pariah
Quote from Madroc
Quote from name:Pariah
Like I said before, the majority of the community has little use for this method. We should be helping mappers to finish maps instead of distracting them with things they shouldn't even be worrying about, such as what to do to stop a map stealer when there isn't even a finished map to steal.

Also, Ahli's method is more than enough to protect a map. Doing anything more is not worth the time. If a map is properly spread and people know about it at SEN, there's no reason to do anything more.
I totally disagree. I think everyone should be interested in this, unless people are just mapmaking for practice, which I've never heard of. I've talked to quite a few people who were mad about their map being stolen. And I don't think that Ahli's is enough. It seems like my method takes less effort anyways.
No, very few people would have a use for this. For this method to be useful the mapmaker would need a completed map, something few mapmakers have. Another thing is that they have to be paranoid enough to think this would actually be a beneficial use of their time.

Also, who are the people you've talked to that have had their map stolen? I'm sure those maps aren't being played regularly on battle.net and that no one really cares who made it. And I'm sure it isn't hard to host the original map yourself and let people download the real version.
Well let's say 50 people who read this will finish a map in the future. I don't think that's unreasonable. In that case, I did what I wanted to accomplish. The only reason I can think of for you to be arguing is that you want this topic closed, and I think that poeple could really get something out of this.

I just talked to a guy yesterday on b.net who said his map, paintball, he said, was all over the list at some point and then someone changed his map and it got spread around, and he will never map again. This isn't the first time I've talked to someone who said something like this.


Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Aug 5 2009, 11:22 pm by Madroc.



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Aug 5 2009, 11:29 pm Demented Shaman Post #13



Quote from Madroc
Well let's say 50 people who read this will finish a map in the future. I don't think that's unreasonable. In that case, I did what I wanted to accomplish. The only reason I can think of for you to be arguing is that you want this topic closed, and I think that poeple could really get something out of this.

I just talked to a guy yesterday on b.net who said his map, paintball, he said, was all over the list at some point and then someone changed his map and it got spread around, and he will never map again. This isn't the first time I've talked to someone who said something like this.
No, I don't care if this topic is closed. I'm just arguing because I believe this method is a waste of time. You want to make mapmakers paranoid about having their credit preserved, and I want to prevent that. I'm not against the spread of ideas, but mapmakers who finish maps should be able to see all points of view and then make a decision as to whether this method is worth the time or not.

Who was the guy? Anyone can make up a bullshit example, whether it's you or the guy claiming he made paintball. If he quits mapmaking for his failure to spread a map then he's an idiot. And since the changed map is being played more than the original, then the original probably sucks and was made better. If you quit over something like that then you're mapmaking for the wrong reasons.

Now let me tell you a story of my own. Yesterday, I met a very popular mapmaker who has a bunch of maps actively played on battle.net. All of them are completely unprotected and he's perfectly happy with that. He has never had a problem with map stealing at all, and he couldn't care less about it. He attributes his success to spreading his map and hosting it himself.



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Aug 6 2009, 12:43 am Moose Post #14

We live in a society.

Quote from name:Pariah
Yesterday, I met a very popular mapmaker who has a bunch of maps actively played on battle.net. All of them are completely unprotected and he's perfectly happy with that. He has never had a problem with map stealing at all, and he couldn't care less about it. He attributes his success to spreading his map and hosting it himself.
Quote from name:Pariah
Who was the guy? Anyone can make up a bullshit example
While your example is probably legit, I still couldn't resist.




Aug 6 2009, 12:46 am Madroc Post #15



Quote from Mini Moose 2707
Quote from name:Pariah
Yesterday, I met a very popular mapmaker who has a bunch of maps actively played on battle.net. All of them are completely unprotected and he's perfectly happy with that. He has never had a problem with map stealing at all, and he couldn't care less about it. He attributes his success to spreading his map and hosting it himself.
Quote from name:Pariah
Who was the guy? Anyone can make up a bullshit example
While your example is probably legit, I still couldn't resist.
I actually thought he was lying to make a point?



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Aug 6 2009, 2:07 am killer_sss Post #16



honestly i have to go with pariah on this which i dare say is crazy considering we are like oil and water. After putting hundreds of hours into a map yes it would be a pain to have a map stolen but at the same time i'm not gona go to the extreme and make sure i have to have credit for this map.

Yes i'm going to put in my name and might even hide it a bit but regardless If someone steals it i'm not going to go apeshit. This right here is what i call too much protection. If you wana go hide a million traps in your map go ahead. I might put one in i may put in none. To me its just not worth it. Honestly i would rather see someone else learn something from my map then work like crazy to make sure they can't.



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Aug 6 2009, 3:32 am Madroc Post #17



Hm I guess to each his own.. I for one will definitely be spending a few hours on this for all of my future maps.

That argument went on for seriously too long.




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Aug 6 2009, 5:20 am Falkoner Post #18



Another thing you may want to add, SC Character Swap, is a program that swaps out characters a-o(I think) for characters only in the actual StarCraft font that look the same, however, in editors, which don't use SC's font, it makes it difficult to read, even though it looks perfectly normal in game.



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Aug 6 2009, 6:31 am Madroc Post #19



I guess it would be helpful to add your suggestions into the OP.



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Aug 6 2009, 6:44 am Excalibur Post #20

The sword and the faith

For the record, Esponeo has shown me a new way of protecting maps that cannot be undone by any mere unprotector. Bypassing it requires a number of modding tools, and even then, is difficult and time consuming. I'd say if anyone has found a protection that has the least drawbacks, he has.

I don't have the specifics to re-create it, but I do have one of the specially protected maps in my possession. I am however not giving it out without his permission.




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