So...

• Monday saw a Department of Homeland Security document being leaked labeling veterans, political activists and right wing members as Extremists.
  
• Wednesday saw Governor Perry of Texas attending one of the 'Tea Parties' where Secede was being shouted.
  
• Thursday saw the same Perry defending a statement he made Wednesday that if it comes to it, Texas can/will secede.
  
• Sometime between Monday and Friday a couple lawsuits were formed over the leaked DHS document and some other infringements by Federal Entities that generally look bad for policies Obama and party are pushing if they succeed.
  

All of the above is stuff I'm fairly certain is true, but I'd like to know what your guys' opinions/information on the matter is. Now for some related items I haven't heard about first hand, but rather from people that listen to political talk shows:

• The Federal Government is supposed to be below the State Governments in terms of power over each state (kind of general statement; representatives are making statements that things like the Stimulus bill are overstepping, related to 10th Amendment and the subject of some of mentioned lawsuits).
  
• Several other Governors share Perry's stance on secession.
  
• Perry doesn't want to run for President so a lot of people are supporting Chuck Norris, and no I'm not joking. Apparently he is quite active politically.
  

Also, I was told Texas is and has been experiencing economic growth and dropping unemployment rates for some time, and that it is currently one of the cheapest places to live currently in the U.S. Was also told in same conversation that they turned down all the stimulus money along with Alaska. On the subject of money, it was also brought up that it is currently thought that if you live in New York, ~67% of your yearly income goes to taxes, and that New York is currently experiencing a large drop in population as people leave the state due to the taxes.

Let me reiterate the point of this topic: I've looked up some of this on the internet to verify, but it is... well, the internet. So I'd like to know what your opinions/information/thoughts on the matters are, and how much of this may be incorrect as my sources tend to be from a single side of the matter (currently the conservative side).

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Apr 18 2009, 10:18 pm by Elvang. Reason: Spelling/grammar

Chuck norris you say? This I gotta find out more about... Lemme see

Chuck Norris doesn't get elected, he elects himself.

I don't know about these facts themselves, but it seems that Igor Panarin's predictions may be coming true .

When Governor Perry said that Texas would secede, it was just a figure of speech... to indicate how strongly he (and the rest of the Tea party protestors) is against Obama's seemingly big government, wasteful spending, and large debts that our future generations will suffer. And yea, many other states share this same view, like the governor(?) from Michigan i think (i'll have to research this.)

Texas IS one of the cheapest places to live in, that's what I absolutely love about this place. Our big big houses cost only like $500k whereas in like places along the coast, a small 1/1 apartment would be like a million or something. And employment rates are dropping (at least in the Austin area) primarily due to the rise of many engineering/technological companies. It's kind of funny but my Dad's company, which focuses primarily on engineering computational fluid dynamics is actually still hiring people even during this time of economic crisis.


Oh and if Texas does secede and Chuck Norris wants to run for President... i'm gonna go hang myself.

I would say something, but I really think this says it all: http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/15/begala.taxes/index.html

I think that might be because no one really wants to live in Texas except Texans. Much like no one really wants to live in the United States except people who come here for an education and then promptly leave, and US-Americans. I also think it's foolish to blame the debt on Obama, at least at this point in time. It was there when he got in, partially due to Democratic congress, yes, but majorly influenced by Republican presidential policies. I don't have a clue if his economic plan will pay off, so I think it's incredibly stupid of people to shun his attempts and the ideas of many brilliant economists who feel that the bailout was the best option. As if they know more than Washington advisers...

If Texas secedes, great, you can all grow upon intelligent design until you can... wait, where does (pseudo)science go from there...?

DT's link is a good one, as well.

Eh. Fox News is retarded, and everyone who protested is too, it's not something surprising. The size of the 'Tea' protests are a sign of how horribly (or fantastically, depending on your expectations) the education system is working.

You can't, however, say that everything is all right in government. The US is the world's second largest polluter (surpassed only by China recently, which pretty much Americanized its economy while keeping firm government control), the most aggressive nation, the nation blamed for throwing the world into recession or depression. It's the state that's by now at least $11 trillion in debt, that's fighting a war on the other side of the world, that's being limited by almost every strong country out there (with the exclusion of France, Germany and the United Kingdom, and even France and Germany aren't best friends with the US these days). As people get restless, they'll want a change, and the more restless they become, the more radical the changes will be. Texas might secede, though only if the crisis gets significantly worse (Not as bad as the GD yet..), etc. Who knows? Some fancy predictor of stuff who's apparently always right pretty much supported Panarin's theory, which I think lends a lot more to it.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/04/hey-rick-can-we-talk.html

I fully endorse the succession of Texas. We'll just airlift Austin to Florida or something to save the good Texans, and let Perry run things his way.

Well, of course you would want to live where you currently live in (circular reasoning.) But my point is that Texas, California, and Florida are the three fastest growing states in America. Based on the US Censuses, these three states are increasing in population (both rate and proportional wise.)
I agree, so far I don't think it's fair to blame Obama for anything yet. I will say that I am definitely glad I voted for him over McCain because I highly doubt McCain would do shit (in this case, risks must be taken, and knowing mcCain he wouldn't do such things.) However, what I find irritating is how some die-hard Obama supporters, who in their defense against Obama's criticisms, only know how to say something along the lines of "well Bush fucked things up" which somehow makes things better altogether. Then you got people like Rachel Maddows who enjoy pressing that in order for Obama's economic plan to be wrong, others must provide a better plan. I wonder how long this attitude will last... (assuming that Obama's plan does goes against all odds and fails miserably.)

Even though Intelligent Design won in the Board of education or something, this IMO will do nothing. Schools and Unversities will still teach Evolution (because this is essentially what consists of a large portion of Biology.) It's just that some schools, particularly the private ones will try to teach intelligent design along with it.

Remember, if you're air lifting Austin, you're also air lifting Rick Perry, because that's where the capitol resides

2/3 of Austin*

Waiting for the day Silvester Stallone runs for governer.

One common misconception is that the "Federal" government consists only of the U.S. National government, that is to say, Congress, the Supreme Court and the President. This is however, false. A "Federal" government consists of two parts: a centralized portion and a multitude of decentralized portions, reflective of our National government and State governments. Often the term "Federal" is used only in reference to what is in reality the "National" government. The real "Federal" government is BOTH parts. As for the balance of power between the two parts, that has been continuously changing throughout our history.

From this we can see that our Founding Fathers did not envision the type of "big government" that we have today, though it may be argued that at the time of the founding it might have been hard to envision a nation o 300 million people, and some centralization was necessary throughout the growth of the United States.

Contrary to the ideals of the tenth amendment above, in the case of Gibbons v. Ogden the Supreme Court ruled that in the case of interstate commerce, when a federal law and state law are in conflict, the federal law is supreme.

Another case of the clash of powers came along with the legal age for alcohol consumption. It is universally 21 across the U.S., but it did not always use to be 21, since that is a matter under the power of the states. The national government did not have the power to regulate that, so it cut funding to the states until they complied with the drinking age.

In a sense, the national government is superior to the state governments, due to its larger legal jurisdiction, power to declare war, levy taxes, support an army, ect, but in many areas, like privacy rights, the constitution is explicit that those are reserved to the states respectively.