nonono. I distinctly remember you bitching about how north had first pick at marine which would give the the win, so you refuse to play them. Echo gave in and gave you the dam marine, and he still totally raped you(you died in the beginning very fast to him giving them the exp edge).

Go watch the finals replay then, please. You're wrong.

lol just got done watching that very hilarious final replay, and I see my error. At that point the MECH was what people were complaining about being broken, and you were whining about not being top because they got rine and mech, so they gave you mech. Pretty much you cost your team the match because you did a very noob spell cast and trapped yourself, to which your immediate response was "w/e rine is OP anyways" while everyone else fell over laughing at how you trapped yourself. The third time you died was moronic as well. And yes in that version mech was the most imba unit because echo ate through the competition with it in all the other games.

I will say though that your mech attack move micro was very good.

Mech has barely even changed since that version, I think maybe vulture HP dropped 400 and a damage which barely matters because it can heal in about 6 seconds with its speed. They didn't "give us" mech, they didn't race for it in any of their previous games, and nothing was said about it being overpowered. Good try though, you managed to be completely wrong again.

They raced for the marine versus us and in semis, and it controlled both games.

The Spec Ops easily won and captured a 1v2 against my teammates in the middle while I was double teamed at bottom. If you think the reason we lost is because of my deaths, you're missing the rest of game badly. They were able to 2v1 me (which DeNo was deadset on, his chat shows that pretty damned clearly) as the Marine overpowered both of my teammates single handedly, even getting a couple of early kills.

I wasn't serious when I told you to continue to make shit up, but I see you took me up on the offer anyway.

You guys should make a thread, "juvenile bickering unrelated to TS1.5 that nobody cares about" and post there instead of taking this thread off topic.

It's not even about v1.5 o.O

On another note...

I require some testers... I'll be online randomly.. but if you want, I can send you the current TS....
I am now attempting to make Engineer, Psion, and Assault less OP.. and make Lurker more appreciated.

Yes, make ed more epic.

I swear I'm the only person that can apparently make full use of it without getting raped >_>

Psion Just needs Less Hp. I think Rine can kill Psion easily, though, if you unswitch Assault's and Spec Ops Powers.

I hope you guys haven't forgotten about v1.5... Even though moose has been doing some good work on the old.
Sorry for not being on staredit for a while, but i felt that I shouldn't say much until I have gotten some work done and some ideas formulated.

Since the "reception" of the beta was bad, I won't be releasing any map versions until the final, satisfactory version is done ^.^...
What I will, however, have a changes and ideas dump right now! So hold on to your noses!!

CHANGES SO FAR
Green = changes to stay
Yellow = changes to debate

- Increased Cost of Mana and Time of Academy and Supply Depot (for Engineer)
- Decreased cost of armored refinery (35 minerals instead of 40)...
- Paralyzing spells will destroy Mounted Guns
- Fixed unclickable tanks/bunker during day.
- Lurker's L2 (Burrow Drive) do not have the spell effects anymore (makes it stealthier during night)
- Lurker's L3 (Tremble Earth) does not affect heroes anywhere. It now has an AoE exactly the same as the Void from Psion (which is quite big.. 16x16?? i forgot)
- Lurker's L1 (SandTrap) Stuns for 4.5 seconds. However, it is unable to stunlock unless traps are placed properly... Meaning that stunned foes will not be stunned again from the same spell for about 5.5 seconds (leaving 1 second to run away).
- Assault can now spawn 3 ghosts, but canNOT cloak.
- Nuke costs 80gas. Same build time.

- Decreased Engineer HP to 4500hp
- Decreased Assault HP to 4000... It's damage is now 11+3 (Major subject of change!)
- Followed Moose's idea and switched L1 with L2. (as Disruption web + marine = rape)
- L1 is changed to "Sensor Grenade". If the scourge is over any foes for one second, it will detonate. The fuse is the same (meaning it's longer than M4)...
- L1's effect is also changed. It will create 4 wraiths (30+4 damage) that attacks once. It will still kill all ground spawns, but will only stun for 2 seconds.
- Mech's L2 and L4 (wraiths) is now 30+4 damage.
- Mech's L4 spawns 8 x 3 wraiths (instead of 12 x 3 wraiths)

IDEAS THAT MAY BE IMPLEMENTED
All of these are up for debate..

- Increase explosion size of Assault's L3 Carpet Bomber. (it's really hard to stun people currently o.O)
- Switch Lurker's L1 and L2. Make Sandtrap spawn 1 or 2 infested terrans AND stun for 4.5 secs.
- Increase Volt's Shields a bit, as it's L2 sucks heroes in per 3 DC's rather than every trigger now.
- Decrease Volt's L3 mana drain.... Make it drain less mana.
- Make Medic's L4 not heal allies to full HP. Instead, Maybe in increments of 20%. If the person's health level is between 20-40, they heal to 40%. if 40-60, 60%, and etc... or maybe increments of 25%'s.
- Maybe change Lurker's L4 to something else.. Maybe remove the creation of Rock Creatures, as they really don't do anything.
- Maybe change cloak to cost 200? It'd give DM, Medic, and Phantom more of an edge.
- Implement new terrain
- Most importantly, Make spawns spawn one higher level spawn per 6 spawns (lol so many "spawns"). So for example, every 6 broodlings, there'd be 1 marine. If u up the spawn number by 1 (+3) .. no extra marine.. if u up it again (now you got +6 from original), you'll spawn 2 marine. Each Higher level spawn will be the 2 levels above it. Zealot spawns will have dragoon, while hydra spawns will have goliaths.

plz leave comments/suggestions ..

Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Mar 5 2009, 10:22 pm by UnholyUrine.

Make sure that the opponents can see engineer's bunkers/tanks...Its annoying when you cant see them.
Also, if you disable cloak on the ghost, the ghost should get more hp.
If assault goes back to 11+3, it the hp should be reducted by a lot. It has ranged and has paralizing spells.
The "Sensor Grenade" is a good idea, but why wraiths? Why not rines/ghosts?
I don't like volt's spell 2 change. 3 DCs is too much. Maybe 2 dcs?
Medic certainly needs to be changed. Changing the max hp by a bit is a good idea.
Lurker's spell 4 is too simple....Maybe you should make an attack move out of it. Maybe like the new Light Of Binding the LM has, but with hydras.
I don't understand the orange part >.< Its unclear

I'm not saying your nerfing lurk or w/e but I am going to appreciate less because of this. Especially the change to its lvl 1.

Then what would you suggest??
And what about the other ideas?

@Yoshi - It means that it's gonna be more like Dota, where each group of spawns, there'll be a "leader" or a single, stronger unit.
I'm setting it to have 1 leader per 6 spawns. So if you up the spawn number once (+3 units), you won't get 2 leaders per spawn. However if you up the spawn number twice, you'd get 12 broodlings and 2 marines.
Oh and I fixed the non-clickable tank/bunker during day thing *edits post*

EDIT: I guess firebats would be okay too .. I'll have to think about that .. it'd be like moose's firebomb in that case.
EDIT2: Marine will either be 11+3 or 16-18+2... which one'd be better?... By the tenth upgrade, both'd still be doing around 30 damage... so it's not a big change..

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Mar 5 2009, 9:37 pm by UnholyUrine.

Having a leader per group migth actually be a good idea. Since broods are only feed, having a marine in the mix might make the spawn pose some threat to the base. But won't it be more feed? What if a DM blocks the spawn and storms? Or a LM that splash farms?
Marine should be 18+2...11+3 is too much. If it has 20 ups as 11+3, it would be doing 71 dmg while 18+2 would be 58. It is still strong, but not too strong. It also has paralizing spells that it lacked in 1.4, so you'll be able to land more hits.
Upgrading spawn should cost 5 civs. It's too easy to get 16 civs early game and kill thier base.
Also, when's the new terrain coming? I'm eager to see it

*edits post again*

Marine would need to get 16 Upgrades JUST to 1 hit KO the spawn... That's a bit weak, don't you think? My only problem is with the oldschool Rine spells... When the rine has enough mana, the rine can spam the mine drone spell, and have an impossible defense.

Because of its small variables in its upgrades, about half of those upgrade will have the rine 2 or 3 hitting spawn + stim. Rine vs spawn isn't a problem.

+3 rine allows it to go HP+damage spam and tear things apart. It's not a matter of just damage, you need to account for rate of fire, which the marine has the fastest in the game besides zergling.

As for the changes to new characters, I'll wait until there's a bugfixed version before even trying to suggest what might be balanced.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Mar 5 2009, 11:21 pm by FaZ-.

Please read carefully before saying something like that. I released Beta for the discussion of the new heroes.. I knew they weren't fixed and I knew there were bugs (just not that many ) If you want to play the already fixed version, then ask me for it.

No point in getting vindictive on me.

Good, you're makeing all the changes in 1 version.... I don't want too many versions floating around B.Net.
Make sure you protected it. There are lots of rigged versions floating around, too.
I really suggest assault should stick with 18+2, especially with the new assault spells.
Also, has MNeox been working on the new terrain? I'm REALLY looking foreward to the terrain

I think 200 for cloak is a good idea, it really is hard to sneak up on people with 225. It would help dm a lot more on casting those spells, because normally, people only use ensnare and storm.

New terrain would be a nice change.

I was actually thinking about the "dota style" spawn like a short while ago, except with a 1 lvl up leader, but 2 lvl is better for posing some threat. I definitely think that should be implemented.

Maybe after the first transition from broods to zerglings, an Abyssal Demon should spawn on all 3 sides. The abyssal demon could have higher hp each time.

Maybe to find some middle ground for Volt, you could alternate death counts for the magnet. Have it go 2 dc's for move trig then 3 dc's for move trig. This way, people who could easily get out of l2, would take a little longer to get out. It would give it a sort of pulsating effect too.

I would really like to help on the new terrain if given a chance.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Mar 6 2009, 4:01 am by FlashBeer.