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Quick triggers knowledge test
Aug 24 2009, 6:04 pm
By: Wormer
Pages: 1 2 >
 
Polls
Give the full description of what happens to the other players, when a victory action is executed for one of the players P.
Give the full description of what happens to the other players, when a victory action is executed for one of the players P.
Answer Votes Percentage % Voters
Player P receives victory. All other players receive defeat. 7
 
22%
None.
Player P receives victory. All other players continue to play. 6
 
19%
None.
Player P and all his true allies receive victory. All other players receive defeat. 14
 
44%
None.
Your variant... (Post in the topic.) 5
 
16%
None.
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Poll has 32 votes. You can vote for at most 1 option(s).

Aug 24 2009, 6:04 pm Wormer Post #1



This test is for those who consider he knows all about triggers (and for all others too!). :-_-:
The only request here is not to cheat (do not make a test map) and to answer just what you think.
(Anyways this is just for fun!)

NOTE: Player Q is a true ally of a player P if and only if Q has ally set to P, P has ally set to Q and both have allied victory flag checked.


Alright, I am curious now ;) The question seems pretty easy... :bleh:
Also, I myself have voted for "my variant" because I don't participate in the test.



Some.

Aug 24 2009, 6:19 pm JaFF Post #2



What is the players/forces configuration? Are there any 'true' allies to P in-game?



None.

Aug 24 2009, 6:25 pm Wormer Post #3



Quote from JaFF
What is the players/forces configuration? Are there any 'true' allies to P in-game?
It does not matter here if there are. You should provide the most exhausting answer to be true in any case.
And no, I don't playing words here.



Some.

Aug 24 2009, 6:26 pm xYoshix Post #4



I dont think I know all about triggers, so this test isn't for me.



None.

Aug 24 2009, 6:29 pm Wormer Post #5



Quote from xYoshix
I dont think I know all about triggers, so this test isn't for me.
Quote from Wormer
(and for all others too!). :-_-:

EDIT: You've chosen the other variant and even don't want to provide an answer :-(



Some.

Aug 24 2009, 6:48 pm Devourer Post #6

Hello

Quote
[08:45 pm]
[DeVouReR]:] -- victory for the player, not for their ally, the other reicve "Couldn't achieve objectives", displayed as "draw" in the score if I remember right
Quote of a shout.



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Aug 24 2009, 6:54 pm lil-Inferno Post #7

Just here for the pie

Option three.




Aug 24 2009, 7:47 pm Ahli Post #8

I do stuff and thingies... Try widening and reducing the number of small nooks and crannies to correct the problem.

I have no f*cking idea :D
I guessed 3.
TBH, I know nothing about triggers ;)




Aug 24 2009, 7:50 pm JaFF Post #9



My guess is that P and all his true allies get victory and all other players continue playing. But Dev's option sounds quite... intuitive, too.

Just ask Lethal or Kaias. >_<



None.

Aug 24 2009, 8:47 pm Kaias Post #10



As I understand it, when a victory action is found it finishes that loop of triggers and ends the game. Any player who doesn't run the victory action in that loop gets a defeat.

So my answer is: None of the above option 4.



None.

Aug 24 2009, 9:02 pm Wormer Post #11



Quote from Kaias
As I understand it, when a victory action is found it finishes that loop of triggers and ends the game. Any player who doesn't run the victory action in that loop gets a defeat.

So my answer is: None of the above option 4.
Huh! You're really-really close (closer than all others to the right answer),
but not exactly exhaustively (missed the most interesting part!). :bleh:
Also your answer contains a false statement.
EDIT: Even two false statements!..



Some.

Aug 24 2009, 9:10 pm Kaias Post #12



Quote from Wormer
Quote from Kaias
As I understand it, when a victory action is found it finishes that loop of triggers and ends the game. Any player who doesn't run the victory action in that loop gets a defeat.

So my answer is: None of the above option 4.
Huh! You're really-really close (closer than all others to the right answer),
but not exactly exhaustively (missed the most interesting part!). :bleh:
Also your answer contains a false statement.
EDIT: Even two false statements!..
I only made two statements.

If players not allied both get victory within that loop, then it draws.

Enlighten me.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Aug 25 2009, 4:36 am by Kaias.



None.

Aug 24 2009, 11:07 pm Vrael Post #13



I voted "my variant" because if I truly wished to know the answer, I would make a test map about it, but you said that's against the rules.



None.

Aug 25 2009, 6:48 am Devourer Post #14

Hello

Quote from Wormer
Quote from Kaias
As I understand it, when a victory action is found it finishes that loop of triggers and ends the game. Any player who doesn't run the victory action in that loop gets a defeat.

So my answer is: None of the above option 4.
Huh! You're really-really close (closer than all others to the right answer),
but not exactly exhaustively (missed the most interesting part!). :bleh:
Also your answer contains a false statement.
EDIT: Even two false statements!..

Dude that's what I said omg.
And no, not defeat, they get told they couldn't achieve the objectives and receive a draw at the score-table, unless a defeat-trigger has run for those players.

For example:
Player 1 : victory.

Player 2,3,4,5,6,7 and 8 will be told they lost the game and receive a "draw" in the after-lobby where the score-table is (that's how I call it, what's the real word for it?)


Or:
Player 1 Victory
Player 2 Defeat

Player 1 will receive a victory, Player 2 a defeat, the rest will be told they couldn't reach the victory and receive a draw.



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Aug 25 2009, 9:49 am Heinermann Post #15

SDE, BWAPI owner, hacker.

Assuming "True Allies" is a two-way alliance. Questioning the outcome of a single action has almost nothing to do with overall trigger knowledge.

Actually, I changed my mind about it. I think Victory is only given to the players that run the trigger, and not even their allies.

This topic is just a forum game IMO.




Aug 25 2009, 11:36 am Moose Post #16

We live in a society.

Trick question.
You didn't say the game was longer than 2 minutes, so it's a draw for everyone.



https://www.collaborativefund.com/blog/how-this-all-happened/
https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2012/11/hipsters_on_food_stamps.html
https://youtu.be/vyiXaCRwZTs
https://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2011/09/how_to_be_mean_to_your_kids.html
http://lab.cccb.org/en/renata-avila-the-internet-of-creation-disappeared-now-we-have-the-internet-of-surveillance-and-control/

Aug 25 2009, 11:47 am Kaias Post #17



Quote from Mini Moose 2707
Trick question.
You didn't say the game was longer than 2 minutes, so it's a draw for everyone.
Actually, you can still get defeat, you just can't win.



None.

Aug 25 2009, 11:59 am Wormer Post #18



Quote from Heinermann
Questioning the outcome of a single action has almost nothing to do with overall trigger knowledge.
What a bore! :omfg: Of course, you're right, "nothing to do with overall trigger knowledge"!.. :poke: :disgust:

Quote from Heinermann
Actually, I changed my mind about it. I think Victory is only given to the players that run the trigger, and not even their allies.
Closer, closer... :rolleyes:

Quote from Heinermann
This topic is just a forum game IMO.
Some kind of, but not quite... It is not just a forum game.

Alright, about 20 people have already voted and I can tell now.
The real reason I made this topic was my personal discovery :lightbulb: concerning victory and defeat actions.
Initially I wanted to make a topic in the UMS Ideas forum, but then decided to diversify life and made it a poll. :teehee:

The catch is that there is no exhaustively full answer provided in the poll. The closest answer in the poll is the first one: "Player P receives victory. All other players receive defeat." My congrats to anyone who chosen it! You can take a flower :flowers: :bleh:

The closest answer among participants was provided by Kaias:
Quote from Kaias
As I understand it, when a victory action is found it finishes that loop of triggers and ends the game. Any player who doesn't run the victory action in that loop gets a defeat.
Kaias, take two flowers :flowers: :flowers: :P

I myself for a very long time was totally convinced it is "Player P and all his true allies receive victory. All other players receive defeat." (BTW, as the poll shows for now this is the most popular answer among mapmakers.) But the really right answer is four: "Your variant... (Post in the topic.)" I won't either provide fully exhaustive answer, because it is very time-consuming to list everything clearly, but I tell you things that amazed me.

The first thing :idea: is that victory (and also draw) does not finish the game after the current trigger loop finishes (though, defeat finishes the game immediately). If there are hyper triggers SC actually runs the next trigger loop, and will continue when the victory action executed again. So, the trigger
Quote from Triggers
TRIGGER
OWNERS: Player 1
CONDITIONS:
ACTIONS:
   End scenario in victory for current player.
   Preserve trigger.
won't finish the game for player 1. I'll leave for you to find all the nuances and consequences this behavior causes.

The second thing :idea: is that, as Kaias truly stated, (I'll rephrase his statement into the true one) any player who runs the victory action in that very loop gets a victory too. The most interesting part is that any player who runs the draw action in that very loop gets a draw; all other players get a defeat! Immediately a little correction: in case the player runs both a draw action and a defeat action, only the latter counts (though victory interrupts both the draw and the defeat, whenever it was executed earlier or later).

Now, please tell me this everything was already known ages ago! I don't care. This was just a personal discovery.
Thanks.



Some.

Aug 25 2009, 12:22 pm Kaias Post #19



Quote from Wormer
The first thing :idea: is that victory (and also draw) does not finish the game after the current trigger loop finishes (though, defeat finishes the game immediately). If there are hyper triggers SC actually runs the next trigger loop, and will continue when the victory action executed again.
I just made a test map to see if you were right about this. It supported my theory; it will finish running through all the triggers like it normally would and not run the next loop of triggers (hypers or not). And defeat doesn't finish the game, it just ends it for the player running it.

Quote from Wormer
The second thing :idea: is that, as Kaias truly stated, (I'll rephrase his statement into the true one) any player who runs the victory action in that very loop gets a victory too. The most interesting part is that any player who runs the draw action in that very loop gets a draw; all other players get a defeat! Immediately a little correction: in case the player runs both a draw action and a defeat action, only the latter counts (though victory interrupts both the draw and the defeat, whenever it was executed earlier or later)
Ah yes, I forgot about the possibility to draw in that loop as well.



None.

Aug 25 2009, 12:31 pm Wormer Post #20



Quote from Wormer
The first thing :idea: is that victory (and also draw) does not finish the game after the current trigger loop finishes (though, defeat finishes the game immediately).
Quote from Kaias
And defeat doesn't finish the game, it just ends it for the player running it.
What I meant there is that it finishes the game immediately after the trigger loop finishes in comparison with the victory action when the next loop executes.

Quote from Kaias
I just made a test map to see if you were right about this. It supported my theory; it will finish running through all the triggers like it normally would and not run the next loop of triggers (hypers or not).
Woot?????/ :shocked: I've tested this myself! Ugh.. wired. Let me test it again.....

EDIT: It has even nothing to do with hyper triggers. Have a look at the test map. And don't tell me it finishes in victory for you...
EDIT2: Ugh! :blush: It is a singleplayer difference! WIRED.

Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Aug 25 2009, 12:49 pm by Wormer.



Some.

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