Anyway, I've got the Archer L3 done. The only problem is that it really likes targetting Cannons over spawn. Haven't tried it with heroes. Then again, how many other heroes have had their damage spells foiled by the units attacking Cannons anyway?
wait what? a new archer l3? i remember you saying about moving companions to l2, but what is this magical l3 spell then?
None.
Maybe we can't have our cake and eat it too. 'Fun' games (at least to faz-) are ones that are 'herocentric', which requires the spawns to be nothing more than food, and not a counter or have game-ending effects.
The irony lies within the sheer number of times FaZ- has advocated for the advancement of spawn over time. Reavers are just the exception for him. Another example of the Straw Man fallacy.
Unless you are agreeing with me and remarking at how funny it he seems to take a double stance, I'd like you to read this. (you all should actually, throwing it around so much)
http://sc.tri-bit.com/IronyWhen faz hates the idea of players being
required to do anything with spawn - if a hero can't handle the problem himself with his spells then something is wrong. I still contend that faz wants spawn to have nothing more than the role of being food.
But this isn't about faz-, and I feel like we're just giving him a hummer paying so much attention to him.
You don't seem to get it. No one wants to go Reavers, because it takes the game completely out of your hands and takes fucking forever. Even if I was guaranteed a win, in a public game I would never go Reavers. It's BORING. Most of us play this game foremost either for fun or for good competition. Reavers fulfill neither. In a tournament where there's a chance of having one of the two later on, yeah, I might use Reavers. But I wouldn't feel good about doing so.
Not even gonna bother.
The logic is sound, whether you agree with it or not. The only reason to get Reavers is a tactical decision that takes the game out of your hands and hopefully wins for you.
Summoner is imbalanced 2v2 by a shitton. Even against Mech and Mutant, probably the ideal counter, I highly doubt you'd be able to keep his exp down.
Newbies are the ones that attempt to REDUCE a summoner's xp. The only thing Mech and Mutant are ideal for is spending all their time which they could be leveling chasing a single ling around the map. You find Summoner gaining too much xp? Take control of the appropriate gates (which could possibly stop the summoner ALTOGETHER, depending on ally) and/or send spawn to different lane to cut off multiple lane leveling. Ez game ;D
You just said newbies are the ones that attempt to reduce his exp income, and then gave an explanation of how to do it... huh? Assuming you were just typing the first part as a obnoxious insult without realizing how absolutely stupid it was:
This helps, but it also locks you into that lane to protect your spawns making you unable to do anything else. I can't think of any classes I'd rather have execute that strategy than the aforementioned two, though. The speed lets you keep his ling count down and the night vision and mines/splash help versus burrow.
This is the type of linear thinking that plagues these boards. Coming from the person who claims that DM would counter Assault, I would assume that they would at least know something fundamental such as that countering a hero doesn't just involve being able to out micro them head on. You may as well say be saying that Volt counters LM because he can avoid him, or that Assassin counters Mutant because you can tele away and not die.
I claimed that a DM counters a Nuker-Assault well, simply because it does. You can exp while adequately protecting your base. No other hero can do so except perhaps the Summoner. I still don't see how people are denying that this is true. You sit the Dark Orb next to the front temple cannons in your base. If you hear a nuke get launched, you circle around the back and maelstrom the ghost. An Orb is not slow enough to get bombed: end of threat.
Mech vs. Summoner: I vulture his lings, if he sends ultras I go 2zz and blast them apart. The only chance a Summoner has against a Mech is in a 1v1 temple race where it's going to beat anyone anyway by virtue of the class. In a 3v3 for a Mech the Summoner is the 3rd easiest hero to me, behind only the magi.
I also like the removal of spawns idea.
-Take the game out of your hands and hopefully win for you? This is exactly what i am talking about, you absolutely have no idea what you are talking about. Only noobs would throw out reavers and "Hope that it will win for them", Reavers are there for the guaranteed win not, something you just randomly throw out. They put the game back in your hands by the way because you gain map control, and pin the heros to their base.
Summoner vs mech, this is why you lose:
-Summoner has swarm
-Summoner out exp's you
-Summoner will always have more mana
-Summoner can mass spawn mech so easy due to 2x/3x income
-Mech Cannot stop Swarmrape of base
-Mech cannot counter himself being swarmed
-His ups will always be better than yours
-He cannot rape abyssals in his best form which is bike mode
-Any mode besides bike = gg mech
Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Jul 21 2009, 9:28 pm by Mini Moose 2707. Reason: Removal of personal attacks.
None.
wait what? a new archer l3? i remember you saying about moving companions to l2, but what is this magical l3 spell then?
Guardian chaingun. How did you miss it?
Maybe we can't have our cake and eat it too. 'Fun' games (at least to faz-) are ones that are 'herocentric', which requires the spawns to be nothing more than food, and not a counter or have game-ending effects.
The irony lies within the sheer number of times FaZ- has advocated for the advancement of spawn over time. Reavers are just the exception for him. Another example of the Straw Man fallacy.
Unless you are agreeing with me and remarking at how funny it he seems to take a double stance, I'd like you to read this. (you all should actually, throwing it around so much)
http://sc.tri-bit.com/IronyRegardless of whether or not there was irony, my point still holds that you are misrepresenting his position.
When faz hates the idea of players being required to do anything with spawn - if a hero can't handle the problem himself with his spells then something is wrong. I still contend that faz wants spawn to have nothing more than the role of being food.
Again, not true. Quotes please.
-Take the game out of your hands and hopefully win for you? This is exactly what i am talking about, you absolutely have no idea what you are talking about. Only noobs would throw out reavers and "Hope that it will win for them", Reavers are there for the guaranteed win not, something you just randomly throw out. They put the game back in your hands by the way because you gain map control, and pin the heros to their base.
Misinterpretation. They don't take the game out of your hands so much as they take the
outcome of the game out of your hands. IE, your role shifts from that of a hero to that of Reaver support.
Genocidal.Legend: Saying "this is not a flame" does not make it so. Last warning to get along with people on SEN. One more personal attack and you are banned.
When I watched the replay and in one of your deaths to volt L2 you lost your orb and you said "OMG I DIDNT KNOW VOLTS L2 SUCKS IN SUMMONED UNITS!".
If you could host that and prove he said something that inexperienced, I believe it could be the final nail in his coffin. Please provide.
I will leave it up to iceman16 to decide weather he wants to post it or not. The point is someone saying something like that has no right to sit here and criticize and try to down others when clearly his meta-game perceptions and basic fundamentals are so bad.
Moose this is NOT a personal attack. What i am saying is facts he lost to ALL those people, he made up excuses vs all those people. I never said "OMG U ARE NUBZ ROFL", in fact i have been pleading with faz- to get better because he can anazlyze but his weak perceptions and skill level block him from providing anything meaningful.
None.
Spoofing exists, by the way.
Just saying.
Moose this is NOT a personal attack. What i am saying is facts he lost to ALL those people, he made up excuses vs all those people. I never said "OMG U ARE NUBZ ROFL", in fact i have been pleading with faz- to get better because he can anazlyze but his weak perceptions and skill level block him from providing anything meaningful.
Again, saying something is something does not make it true.
Something does not have to be in typical battle.net trash talk to be a personal attack. The essential implication is that you're saying he's bad. Regardless of whatever denotation is used, the connotative meaning is still there and it is still a personal attack.
Spoofing exists, by the way.
Just saying.
Saying somebody lost is a personal attack? I never called him a nub, disrespected him, or trashed him in that post. What i was stating WERE facts. Things that actually happened, let the op sen public know what his "TS resume" is.
Seriously get it together, All I am saying is I want him to get better. I didnt make up anything or say anything that was not true. So how was it a personal attack?
Oh I get it, Faz- loves moose siege, you gotta pay fanservice. No problem.
You Delete CAFG's post to? For what? If he wants to Faz- saying that let him. What is the problem with you, nobody attacked him or slandered him. At all.
Faz- saying "OMG I DIDNT KNOW L2 DOES THAT" is attacking himself, and exposing him for what he really is. He buried himself by saying what he said, i just provided the coffin.
Now you are implying people spoof faz-'s names in a game. Cut it out like a coupon, don't even go there. You are really PUSHING it with that one.
Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Jul 21 2009, 9:47 pm by Genocidal.Legend.
None.
Oh I get it, Faz- loves moose siege, you gotta pay fanservice. No problem.
Implication: FaZ- is a sycophant.
Not a personal attack?
You Delete CAFG's post to? For what? If he wants to Faz- saying that let him. What is the problem with you, nobody attacked him or slandered him. At all.
Because your trash-talk doesn't belong on the public forums. Keep it in PMs. It doesn't help me to improve the game.
Let's analyze the post which I edited. My comments are in
orange.
-No you actually claimed DM counters assault. (No quotes, no proof.) This keeps going back to what I was talking about FaZ-, This is not a flame this fact (Saying that does not make it so) ok, You lost to iceman16 two nights ago to his volt. When I watched the replay and in one of your deaths to volt L2 you lost your orb and you said "OMG I DIDNT KNOW VOLTS L2 SUCKS IN SUMMONED UNITS!". This is not something that should coming out of a good players mouth, I am sorry. (Implication: It came out of your mouth, therefore you are not a good player. Since he is not good the normal assumption is...) Once again you lose, and say something that , frankly, amateurs would say. (Implication: FaZ- is an amateur.) Everyone knows Volts L2 sucks in summoned units, its a fundamental of TS, its just something everyone knows. (Implication: FaZ- is very different from "everyone" and not in a good way.) Yet you been on this forum forever (Implication: FaZ- is even more incompetent because he's had so much time.) and you just find this out, but you sit here and put up this fron like you know what you are talking about. Your fundamentals and meta-game perceptions are totally off-point and base. This is also why you lost to o0MaXX0o Twice, despite have overwhelming advantages, your grasp of the fundamentals are just bad. (How many times have I told you to stop reposting this?) Now Iceman has knocked you off, and you died before night if i remember correctly. This is why nobody pro will take you seriously, when you sit here and criticize and give suggestions I think of it this way:
Like a Junior Varsity Basketball player trying to give Phil Jackson pointers on how to run his NBA team. (Direct attack through analogy.)
This is not a flame at all, (Saying that does not make it so) what I am trying to say is you need to get better and start playing good people. (Implication: FaZ- sucks. I doubt he needs to get better because he's good?) When you get better you have better perceptions about the game and can analyze the game critically and correctly. Some of the things you say are just absolutely wrong. You lost to maxx 3v1, (How many times have I told you to stop reposting this?) another time where you had map control and your L1 one-shotted him and you still lost, You have lost to StalinG, and Iceman16 knocked you off....I never heard of you winning at all in fact (Implcation: FaZ- REALLY sucks because he's apparently never won a single game.), are you telling me ALL of these guys you let them win? No I doubt it, please get better, get your fundamentals up. (Implication: FaZ- sucks. I doubt he needs to get better because he's good?) This is not a flame, (Saying that does not make it so) i am not calling him a noob or trying to trash you at all, its just you say these things that reveal just how little you REALLY know. (Direct: You know very little.)
Get better. Get skilled. (Implication: FaZ- sucks. I doubt he needs to get better because he's good?) I would love to have another pro join the conversation.
Good luck.
I have no idea what you are talking about. Though you said it I didnt......
Though moose, since you went through the trouble of saying "He obviously sucks". Why would you want to keep someone like that around to improve your game? Just an innocent question.
None.
Though moose, since you went through the trouble of saying "He obviously sucks".
I said that? Quote(s) please.
Why would you want to keep someone like that around to improve your game? Just an innocent question.
Why would I keep people around? Because this is the StarEdit Network. Not Temple Siege Network.
Honestly, you underestimate me if you think I'm going to implement every single idea posted by everyone.
Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jul 21 2009, 10:12 pm by Mini Moose 2707.
Nothing more I can say, pictures are worth a 1000 words. CAFG, Would you like a hammer?
I mean to keep him around to improve "Temple Siege", Not to keep around SEN. He can stay on sen, obviously, but why would you let inexperienced people tell you what to do on your TS map?
None.
Look Moose if I came off brash and disrespectful I am sorry. The point is sometimes it just seems you just listen to guys like that, more than the others. I mean no disrespect to you what so ever.
None.
There is more to respect here at SEN than just me.
(Though, that is getting off-topic.)
I will admit that I've made a few bad decisions, but that's part of the learning experience.
Quote from ShredderIV
wait what? a new archer l3? i remember you saying about moving companions to l2, but what is this magical l3 spell then?
Guardian chaingun. How did you miss it?
I looked in your progress and back for about 6 pages, and didnt see anything... but now i'm psyched about it lol
And although everyone might think faz is a noob, its actually understandable if he isnt good. When i joined sen, i wasnt actually very good at ts either. I think people need to learn that ts actually has a moderate learning curve, and no one is going to get better overnight. also, i trust moose, and if someone suggests an idea that is obviously "noob" i trust him to know that it's not a good suggestion. It's not like moose is taking every suggestion from everyone and implementing them into the game...
None.
I think people need to learn that ts actually has a moderate learning curve, and no one is going to get better overnight.
Wrong. What makes TS to fun and popular is that it actually IS easy to pick up, and I DID learn it over night.
Genocide, notice how I don't call him a noob disqualifyanything he may say because he didn't know something that I thought any idiot would know
Quote from ShredderIV
wait what? a new archer l3? i remember you saying about moving companions to l2, but what is this magical l3 spell then?
Guardian chaingun. How did you miss it?
I looked in your progress and back for about 6 pages, and didnt see anything... but now i'm psyched about it lol
And although everyone might think faz is a noob, its actually understandable if he isnt good. When i joined sen, i wasnt actually very good at ts either. I think people need to learn that ts actually has a moderate learning curve, and no one is going to get better overnight. also, i trust moose, and if someone suggests an idea that is obviously "noob" i trust him to know that it's not a good suggestion. It's not like moose is taking every suggestion from everyone and implementing them into the game...
What you are saying is understandable. TS does have a learning curve, everytime I thought I reached the pinnacle i was sorely mistaken still more to learn. Though FaZ- has sat there and bad mouthed pros before like he was pro, now he got exposed. Also Somewhere he [
b]I THINK[/b] claimed he was the best mech player as well. Though I guess you are right, if moose knows an idea is noob, I'm sure he will discard it with better judgement. Nice Hollow Ichigo pic btw.
CAFG is right on the other hand because it is easy to pick up and play, the curve comes in when you start facing people on a higher level. The curve steepens and tiers come into play.
Genocide, notice how I don't call him a noob disqualify anything he may say because he didn't know something that I thought any idiot would know
Yes I noticed but, that just goes back to my original point. Someone who doesnt know fundamentals or have strong fundamentals in TS, will generally talk inexperienced and have no idea what he/she is talking about 99% of the time. This isn't just in regards to FaZ- btw, this is just my general experience with guys who are inexperienced.
*Thanks moose, i forgot to insert I think. My Bad.
Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Jul 21 2009, 11:05 pm by Genocidal.Legend.
None.
I think people need to learn that ts actually has a moderate learning curve, and no one is going to get better overnight.
Wrong. What makes TS to fun and popular is that it actually IS easy to pick up, and I DID learn it over night.
not saying it's not easy to learn... maybe i put it wrong... It takes a while to actually get
good at ts, with a variable to your previous micro and such sc skills.
also, key words there: get better
None.
