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This game is another MOBA, but it's not quite what you might be used to. You choose one of about 22 bloodlines and fight the enemies. There are 4 classes: the tank, melee damager, ranged damager and healer. Every bloodline has 7 abilities. And every ability is (for the most part) dodge-able. The game is purely skill-based, so you always have to be doing something with your character.

Movement is WASD-based. Your primary abilities are left and right mouse buttons. Q, E and R are other abilities. F is your ultimate, which consumes all of your energy. Space bar is usually a defensive, mostly escape ability (jumping, porting and shielding).

Energy is accumulated when you damage an enemy or heal an ally up to 100%. When you reach the limit, you can use your ultimate. There is no mana system, so every ability is simply on cooldown. This makes the game really fast-paced.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Jun 10 2011, 4:31 am by Artanis186.

what is a MOBA?

I play this occasionally with a friend from hon. It's pretty fun however I personally don't care enough to be a tryhard. I pick gunner almost every time and just shoot people. I have no idea what the enemy is casting, don't care to learn all the spells and heroes, /casual mode on.

Multiplayer Online Battle Arena

It's a stupid term pedoHunteR_ tried to get the HoN community to adopt and as a result a bunch of clueless journalists used the term when they reviewed the game. It's terribly nondescript, though, and no one in the gaming industry actually uses it.

I looked at this game in pre-Beta but couldn't get myself a key, might give it another shot now... It seems a lot more WoW-Arena than DotA, to me.

Yeah, I agree. This seems like it's really really heavily based on WoW's arenas (sans bonus attributes) and because of that I'm not so sure I care to get into it. I will say I do like the idea of it being based more on the ability of the player effectively hitting enemies rather than stacking a ton of one stat, however. I was actually looking at the wiki page for MOBA yesterday and saw this on there and started heavily reading up on it, what a strange coincidence.

I believe it's a port of a war3 customs called warlocks. As very much like Hex Arena in sc2.

Take HoN/LoL, take out the items + creeps + levels, making it an arena of heroes vs heroes. Give the heroes some escape / close the gap spells, make all the other spells non-targetable/non-heatseaking/etc and boom, you got bloodlines.

I was gonna start playing this until they announced that it would be micro transactions.

Reminds me much of the recently announce D3 PvP arenas.

Anyone playing this a lot want to review it? I'm still somewhat interested...

Except D3 Arenas involves items, gems, talents, etc. Sadly it isn't solely based on skill, though it is at least better than WoW's arenas. This game seems like it really emphasizes that only the player's skills will help you, rather than gear choices, which seems interesting.

This game is open right now. I played 15 games or so tonight, it was pretty fun and there's only 30 or so heroes so it doesn't seem like the learning curve is going to be too difficult. Only complaint so far is that no one really seems to use matchmaking much, takes 5 minutes or so to find a game, but I guess it doesn't help that I was playing at 4 A.M. ...

Anyone playing still?

Downloading now :3

Edit:

"Today (June 8th) at 09:00 UTC we will take down the servers for maintenance. Expected downtime will be four (4) hours.
No patch will be applied at this time."

Lame.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jun 8 2011, 12:50 pm by Cardinal.

The reason is that once you get to the higher levels, you see how imbalanced the game is. You gotta buy the most expensive, most powerful and utter dominant hero in the game if you want to be 'good.' Most people quit the game once this became apparent, like myself.

Seems like there's a lot of variety? There's tons of discussions about which heroes complement each other.

As far as I can tell they're all 17000, too, none are the most expensive.

That's bollocks LoveLess no offense. But this isn't DotA. There is no Finger of Death 500 damage instant cast bullshit, and no Mortred 4x crit striking you for 600+ damage.

Each hero has a unique skill set - and the majority of players I play with on EU (Tournament level players...) choose Bloodlines according to two factors... How fun/how much they enjoy a heroes play style, and, how the hero fits into their team composition. You almost never see teams with identical hero setup's at the top level because everyone is unique and enjoys different play styles - on top of the fact that it takes about 24 hours of playing time to unlock your first hero - out of a possible choice of 30... Sure - there are general trends in what players pick what heroes, but that's just a 'popularity' effect. For example, I've been seeing Psychopomp (healer) in quite a few games and it seems like a cool hero. But - I tried her out in single player and absolutely hated it... You have to basically rely 90% on your team, and that is why this particular hero 'seemed' awesome to me initially... Because I was a Ranged DPS hero and the Psychopomp on my team was pro and kept me alive when I had full aggro from a 5 man team.

The main reason I'm hating on your "omg game is imbalanced, I'm not playing any more" shpeel is because this game is skill-centric. The Gunner - for example - has powerful skills, but his mouse1 normal attack is almost impossible to aim. Similarly, the Harbinger has strong abilities at stealing his enemies life but is ultimately weak - his play style revolves around harassing and gaining energy, and then using his ultimate with 100% energy and gaining back his life lost while harassing.

My last point is the learning curve of this game.. It's a brilliant game for the simple reason that it is simple to learn, but will take a few months to perfect just one hero. Add on another few months for each other hero, since you cant play effectively against a hero which skills/cooldowns/general mechanics you don't understand.

Disclaimer: I like this game. But it's an acquired taste. The matchmaking system is flawed, partly due to the skill-level jump between a new player and someone who knows a couple heroes/positioning. As such, the ladder system is pretty pointless except at the top of the top level. The only real value/way to rate a player is their competition within a team. That renders solo laddering pointless - on a competitive level. The general playerbase seems to be comprised of hyped up kids on Ritalin who whine and bitch constantly. The game pace is too fast in my opinion, makes it hard to even learn the basics (reading your tooltips / buff effects etc). But this is necessary to maintain the skill-ceiling in separating the wheat from the chaff (ie: Counterstrike - no headshot = no shot at all, basically).

Give it another chance :3 - we'll get a team going and kill people.

Edit: Do I always sound like a dick when I post here?

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jun 10 2011, 1:44 am by Cardinal.

Saw a video of it

Looks interesting.. Will try it

The decision to strip it down to just heroes vs. heroes is interesting. But it really depends on how they handle the abilities and etc.

Okay..

I've played this game for at least 4 hours.. and I have to say..
I agree with both Cardinal and Loveless.
AND that I've actually enjoyed the game..

Bloodline Champions takes its roots from Dota-AoS, but changed the combat mechanics so that everything requires input from the players.. like OP described, even melee attacks need to be button-mashed and "aimed" (pointing the cursor in the general direction of the enemy in reference to your own hero).

I think this is a great combat design. It really requires skills, timing, and positioning.

The other thing that the OP should've described is the fixed design of every hero's ability. This.. isn't the best idea, but I can see where they were going with it. The "Seven" abilities really amounts to 3 abilities, 1 ultimate, 1 basic attack, 1 secondary attack, and an escape/tank ability. I think that having every hero have their abilities mapped out like this lessens the learning curve dramatically, and is a combat style that I can get used to.

However... after maybe 2 hours, battles already felt repetitive. (And No, I've played every ranged and melee heroes, and several healers as well). The fixed styles of the abilities make the strategies between heroes vary only slightly. This is acceptable as long as the 3 abilities and 1 ultimate are unique, and besides, dota/LoL/HoN only has 4 abilities.. Right?

This is where the developers fell short. They, indeed, took inspiration from Dota.. and took the bad aspects of the game as well.

First of all, the 4 "Unique" abilities (3 abilities + ultimate) are hardly unique.. The abilities feel token.. like I've seen them elsewhere before..If you play the game long enough, you'll start seeing abilities that have almost identical style and functionality.. like Living Flame=Parry=Spike Shield=Stalker's Cloak... or how Volcano=Mortar=Wind Bomb=EMP Blast=Ice Arrows... And then there're Blatantly Copied abilities that does 99% the same thing.. Cloak == Camouflague .. It is because they were so methodical with their ability design that they made the game extremely repetitive.

This is worsened by the fact that the game is a stripped version of Dota/AoS, as there are no creeps/spawns and bases to protect/conquer. It is only hero vs. hero.. Abilities vs. abilities. This causes the bland nature of the heroes' abilities to be even more of an issue.

Another problem that's more widespread is how Bloodline Champions, like many AoS's, have fallen into the "We're gonna categorize the heroes, and (will) throw a ton of heroes at you, but the heroes themselves have little variances.. but you hardcore fans will be able to take these differences apart" Trap. Or, in other words.. the "Dota did it, so we're gonna copy them" Trap.

Simply by categorizing the heroes, the developers have already limited their heroes' design. This is apparent when comparing ranged heroes like The Gunner, The Igniter, and the.. erm.. Arrow guy. Their LMB and RMB's are nearly identical, and all of them have a ranged AoE, and Protective ability.. and blah blah blah. In essence, the heroes' play styles are so similar that it makes the game less entertaining.

The next flaw that I have with the game that stems from Dota is a bit more controversial: the design choice to completely dismiss Mana/Energy usage for abilities in favor of cooldowns. A parallel example is the design choice to give Duke Nukem regenerating health instead of Hit Points in DNF. While regenerating health (and cooldowns) have their place in certain games, it is definitely not the best choice for this game.
In DNF, the regenerating health forces players to play it safe, taking cover and wait in order to regain Duke's health. The strategy surrounding this design choice just doesn't fit in a Duke game, where a player wants to just go balls out and take out enemies. In Duke 3D, Items that regenerate Hit Points are scattered around the map. This forces the player to explore. This design provides a great conflict for the player - should I explore a bit to find more health, but risk running into more enemies? Or should I just keep going? With regenerating health, the game is totally different, and is a lot slower and less "duke-like" because of it.

In Bloodlines, the dismissal of Mana/Energy required for abilities has both pros and cons. The advantage is that there's one less number players to worry about. It also makes the game feel faster, as players wouldn't need to sit tight or kite around to wait for mana to regen. Only the ultimate ability requires Energy.. but that is gained by dealing damage.

The disadvantages to this, however, seem to outweigh its pros. There is a lack of strategy in using each ability. If I am The Gunner, I just spam the "Disabling Shot", "Cloak", and "Mortar" whenever I get the chance. That's no fun, because it detracts the weight from the abilities. Moreover, being able to save up Mana in order to "Execute" three times quickly is a lot more thrilling and unpredictable than waiting for the bloody thing to cooldown.

This also keys into the problem that many of the Dota Heroes have. Hey Cardinal, remember when you said Pudge is too straightforward, and its abilities have "the bad kinds" of synergy? Welp, the heroes of Bloodlines have the exact same problem. And the worst thing is, it would've all been mitigated if they chose to use Mana/Energy for abilities instead of Cooldowns.
Just think about it.. Instead of trying to Volcano whenever I can in order to get the best out of my abilities... I can conserve my mana. Then, when I am able to land that ranged Stunning spell (which is an awful lot like many of the other ranged stunning spells..) I can choose to do multiple Volcanos, or Fire Blitz's - Volcano being faster and more easy to land, and Fire Blitz being the slower, but higher Damaging spell.

What's even worse is the fact that Bloodlines also copied probably the worst parts of Dota/LoL/HoN (In my Opinion). It is the number game again. First of all, Bloodlines is already a lot better, as there're no x% chances of doing y effect of z damage sort of shit. The abilities will ALWAYS do a y effect of z damage (So we're 2 numbers down now, YAY!). BUT.. many of the spell effects are so minuscule that it hardly matters. And this is coming from a company called "Stunlock studios"..

All of the heroes have indistinguishable speeds. Pretty much any effects on speed is negligible in the game. Also, most effects last for less than 5 seconds. That's hardly enough to notice. Yeah, I know it works in theory, but in practical sense, players don't care. This is especially funny when playing as a healer, as you're supposed to sort out, in the thick of battle, which one of your allies is inflicted with something.. put your cursor over them, and press a corresponding letter.. IF the ability's not in cooldown (And trust me, the cooldown's too long for some of the spells).. all in less than 5 seconds for it to have any real effects. Wtf??

This not only has repercussions in countering ability effects, it also causes the combat to usually end up in a huge mess. Granted I'm not playing on the highest levels... But even when I'm playing as probably the most meticulous hero - The Gunner - I still feel the combat's usually a mess of stuff. Due to the hugely inefficient secondary effects of abilities (and, in part, the art design of the ability effects), battles just become a big clusterfuck. Yes, the battles are fast and furious, and are skill-based, but speedy design can be partnered with strategy. Heroes' abilities just don't seem to have weight in them, and especially when playing as a healer or a tank, you can easily shrug off the damage from most of the spells.

Also, the art design of some of the abilities are extremely lacking. Like the Blow Dart, Toxic Bomb, and Frog Leap for the assassin.. The X-strike and Wind Strike from the Nomad.. Drunken Haze and Parry from the reaver, The Spike Shield from the Ravener.. The Machine Gun from the Engineer, and etc. etc.

I think that forcing players to strategize, predict, and position their heroes and their abilities is a more entertaining and rewarding gameplay mechanic. Right now, I feel like I'm playing a top down fighter... where i'm just button mashing q-e-r and f.. and sometimes the spacebar to escape.. It's entertaining, but only just.

I also want to point out that the game's Map design is also lacking.. They are extremely repetitive as well...
I mean.. since you've stripped away all the bases and stuff.. shouldn't there be like freaking environmental hazards.. Vision altering mechanics.. or even Environment altering stuff, like , the arena starts crumbling and gets smaller over time? The game lacks the amount of polish and forethought to keep me playing X.X

.. lol... so this is where SmashCraft was from XD
AND EVEN Smashcraft has Environment Altering mechanics (that lava map where the lava rises occasionally).

And... The Reaver's probably the most bland and uninteresting hero that I've EVER played... His ultimate's a complete joke wait.. no.. the Bandit from iDT's Temple Siege is the most bland one.. The Reaver's second.

So.. I agree with Loveless in that people will leave the game once they figure out how repetitive the design of the heroes are (And I also feel that The Gunner is OP.. which is why I used her the most XD).. But I Also Agree with Cardinal in that it is worth a try - the combat mechanics is really good and is a step above all other AoS/DotA's.
It's a shame that that's all they've got

Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Jun 13 2011, 12:01 am by UnholyUrine.

Been playing this every now and then recently. With the 2.0 patch overhaul they fixed a hell load of stuff (especially balances). While still no where close to perfect, the game is averagely balanced now. Recently the developers have finally taken a more active role in patches and communicating with the community. Overall I think this game is extremely fun but it is defintely exponentially better when playing with friends.

@UU's post: (even though it was like 2 years ago)

Completely agreed on the non-uniqueness of abilities and I really wish they would come out with better bloodlines. But I still think most bloodlines are a different experience each.

Disagreed on your cooldown points. You can't spam your abilities whenever they come off cooldowns; cooldowns are rather long for how short the actual games are. When you are playing versus good people, missing one core spell can be defeat and sometimes you have to wait a while to have that perfect moment to use that spell. This is especially true with your escape mechanisms. If you missuse those in this game then you are dead meat right away. But really I guess this is just personal preference.

@Speed: I couldn't disagree with you more. Speed is one of the most important aspects. They changed speeds around as of 2.0, but even pre-2.0 speed was very nice. This whole game is skillshot oriented and having fast speed makes a big difference. Speed right now is considered to be either the best of 2nd best trait that you can have (you can buy stat increasing items now, kinda bad). Having +20 speed over your opponent does make a difference.

@Maps: The maps are different but having such small maps you can only make some differences. But the problem with changing a map completely is that it can change the balance of the game. There is one map with a central area and then like 8 bridges coming off of that area leading to another area. This map is considered the worst map in the game because it is clear that half of the bloodlines in this game completely rape the other half when playing on this map.

@Reaver: Agreed this hero sucks but they said they are going to change him soon.


All in all I reccomend that everyone plays or at least tries this game. At first it is fun, then you start getting raped and it sucks, then you get better and it becomes real fun again. Although I must stress that playing with friends on a team is a 100x better experience than playing the dreaded solo queue.

Somebody play this with me yo!