Staredit Network > Forums > Staredit Network > Topic: Group-think and Arrogance
Group-think and Arrogance
Dec 9 2009, 7:01 pm
By: Vanished  

Dec 10 2009, 12:38 am Vanished Post #21



Quote from CecilSunkure
Quote from Vanished
I appreciate everyone's comments, but Mini Moose 2707 didn't reply concerning his spam in my thread. He, as administrator, edited a number of my posts. He also removed a post of mine.

I would like my post to be reposted or have Mini Moose 2707's spam removed from my thread. That's a request. Thank you.
Sounds like your'e just looking for others to make a mistake in order to redeem your horrid attitude.

Just admit your fault and move on -don't try to blame anyone else for anything. That's a request. Thank you.

My post wasn't meant to be sarcastic, rather literal.

I admit no fault. Please quote where my conduct is unacceptable; I may change my mind.



None.

Dec 10 2009, 12:39 am Vrael Post #22



Quote from Vanished
removed from my thread.
All material contained in the domain http://www.staredit.net is the lawful property of the owner thereof. The Owner shall henceforth be referred to as MemberID:1 or IsolatedPurity.

Someone's going to do it, so it may as well be me:
Site FAQ: http://www.staredit.net/?p=faq
SEN Terms of Service: http://www.staredit.net/?faq=1
SEN Rules: http://www.staredit.net/?faq=2

I will now post some noteworthy passages from these links:
Quote from name:The Rules
Don't be a dick.
Quote from name:The Rules
Respect the Staff
Quote from name:The Rules
If the administrator moderated you, tough luck.
Quote from name:The Rules
•Do not disrupt SEN to prove a point.
Quote from name:The Rules
•The administration is in charge and can do whatever they want. (but ideally won't have to force things) If you feel that an administrator is acting out of line, please engage us in intelligent dialogue. We're people, too. We can be reasoned with. Sometimes, we will just still disagree. You'll have to suck it up and deal with it. Life's tough.
Quote from name:Terms of Service
Your use of Staredit Network ("SEN") and any services it offers are subject to these Terms of Service ("TOS") at all times, regardless of whether or not you read them. They may be modified at any time without notice. Your use of SEN constitutes acceptance of the TOS as well as any modifications made to it. You understand that you are also subject to other rules.
Quote from name:Terms of Service
If, at any time, it is judged that it is not in SEN's best interest to maintain your membership, it may be terminated
Quote from name:Terms of Service
When posting or submitting typed content, you understand that this website is privately owned and operated, and therefore Freedom of Speech (or your country's equivalent) does not apply, and you forfeit any rights to claim it. We reserve the right to reproduce, edit, move, or delete any and all content that you submit at any time, for any reason.

Hope that helps :)



None.

Dec 10 2009, 12:41 am CecilSunkure Post #23



Quote from Vanished
Quote from CecilSunkure
Quote from Vanished
I appreciate everyone's comments, but Mini Moose 2707 didn't reply concerning his spam in my thread. He, as administrator, edited a number of my posts. He also removed a post of mine.

I would like my post to be reposted or have Mini Moose 2707's spam removed from my thread. That's a request. Thank you.
Sounds like your'e just looking for others to make a mistake in order to redeem your horrid attitude.

Just admit your fault and move on -don't try to blame anyone else for anything. That's a request. Thank you.

My post wasn't meant to be sarcastic, rather literal.

I admit no fault. Please quote where my conduct is unacceptable; I may change my mind.
Mine was both literal and sardonic.

About that quote.. Well, I can't exactly quote what Moose moderated, but whatever it was was unacceptable.

Quotes: http://www.staredit.net/194999/



None.

Dec 10 2009, 12:44 am Moose Post #24

We live in a society.

Quote from CecilSunkure
About that quote.. Well, I can't exactly quote what Moose moderated, but whatever it was was unacceptable.
Yes you can.




Dec 10 2009, 12:47 am Vanished Post #25



Vrael, I know how to find the rules. Thank you though.

I was actually looking for my posts in context please. Although, I do recall being defensive in the midst of hostility.



None.

Dec 10 2009, 12:52 am Vrael Post #26



I thought an illustration of some of the major points was necessary.



None.

Dec 10 2009, 1:00 am Vanished Post #27



Quote from Mini Moose 2707
If you had rechecked the thread, you would have found that my post was already removed.

Thank you, Moose.



None.

Dec 10 2009, 2:35 am MEMEME670 Post #28



I personally feel, although we addressed how the acting of SEN affected the map creator, we didnt address how the map creator affected the acting of SEN.

You won't ever want to play another mass game after this one.

^Makes me feel like he is slightly arrogant, however isnt that big of a deal.

If you don't post more information than that, there's a chance your thread could get locked.

Tell us why we should play the game.

^This was legit, nice, and, although not overly friendly (cant expect that.) not mean at all. And yet...

Rude. I prefer to let the game speak for itself.

^Slightly arrogant again, i dont see how he is offended by the post. He then procedes to quote his first post, without any reason why its relevant (and personally, i dont feel it is) But this isnt that bad, and is ignored.

Next two posts are fine, although he comes off as arrogant again, not all that much though.

Yoshis post can come off as aggressive, but he gives a legit reason, so it shouldnt.

Vanished procedes to quote his first post, misunderstanding what no information meant, however this is fine.

Next two posts are actually friendly.

HERE is where it actually gets interesting. UU posts in his usual style, although claiming none of his opinions are true since he hasnt played the map.

Vanished takes on a defensive stance, the first real argumentative post that ive seen this whole forum (although you could argue UUs, but he claims "Tho I haven't played this yet, so we'll c if it's fun" although that can be taken as sarcasm, in the context it doesnt seem to be.

From here on out, both sides (UU and Vanished) play to their respectives, UU trying to explain to vanished why his map isnt the greatest, and how he could improve it (in an argumentative way, yes, along with critisizing his first few posts, although thats more legit.)

Everyone gets mad at UU, and he seems to take this into account, although getting slightly more aggro because of it.

Argument continues, Many valid points are presented (one main one, which still hasnt been really answered by Vanished) with what seems like arrogance coming from vanished, and from most of SEN, however, this is mostly irrelevant at this point.

My main point was to say that Vanished seems to bring this upon himself. Also i felt like continuing with the whole critisize whole forum thing, it was good.



None.

Dec 10 2009, 2:39 am Falkoner Post #29



Admittedly, Vanished was somewhat rude, however, it seems quite obvious to me that UnholyUrine is simply dissing simpler maps because he's gotten a massive head from Temple Siege, there are different types of maps, entertaining in their own aspects.

Vanished, you were being a little close-minded, for example: "Thanks for the reply. I won't be using that idea.", although you are being honest with him, you could have given a bit more reason as to why you didn't want to use the idea, because it made it seem like you saw no need for improvement, which is never true.

However, as much as Vanished was in the wrong, Unholy showed just as much arrogance, if not more in any of his posts, for example:
Quote
To me, it's just a massing game with a gambling system Tacked on... It's gimmicky. Tho I haven't played this yet, so we'll c if it's fun. But it is pretty obvious that the gambling part doesn't integrate into the game.

Specifically, "it's just a massing game", sure, the idea isn't horribly original, but neither is basically any game idea, that would be like me saying "Temple Siege is just Custom Hero Wars with a bigger map", it's very rude, and completely untrue, just as your statement was regarding this map, you had never played it, chances are he made several tweaks to the normal Bunker Wars idea, but since you decided not to take the time to play the map, you made a bad blanket statement and came off as rude. Play a map before you choose to diss it.
Honestly, the farther I get into the topic, the more pronounced your arrogance becomes, "It's a massing game... It's one of those really simple to make and it's one of those i-don't-know-why-pubbies-still-play-this-piece-of-shit games.", "there hasn't been good new bunker war versions at all". Basically, you continued to assume the map was bad, simply because it wasn't entirely original, which is comical considering almost no SC map is.

After playing the map however, Urine had better comments, more constructive criticism, albeit, still in a derogatory tone, but improved, because he played the map, this is where Vanished was now in the wrong again, by continuing to ignore constructive criticism, although I can't truly blame him with the manner it was given in.

What it comes down to is not being rude, you can say "grow some balls" all you like, but it also takes some balls to come into a topic and not be a total douche with your comments, especially in a Map Showcase thread, because people have spent hours on a map, they don't want to hear that it's bad, especially if it's told in a very rude way, be critical, but be polite about it.



None.

Dec 10 2009, 3:13 am UnholyUrine Post #30



Which later I handily elaborated on, and even played the game just to prove my point....

Ye-eah.. by just quoting this part, I did seem a bit arrogant there.. but I've always been pretty critical about game design :\ before or after Team Sage.

Moreover, i've already read his replies beforehand, and I already knew he was being a bit arrogant, what with "You won't ever want to play another mass game after this one." .. "Rude. I prefer to let the game speak for itself." (Tho the argument in of itself is true... maybe the game SHOULD speak for itself .. the "rude" was.. unecessary.) .. and of course "Thanks for the reply. I won't be using that idea." ... So, it's pretty dam obvious he wasn't a nice guy, and since, under sturgeon's law, it is 90% crap, I decided to slam him down with my usual tone of voice - the way any critique would to people they don't exactly like.

I'd understand why you'd get defensive about this if that's all I posted, but I posted a lot more. I focused on why people sounded rude and that his comments would be counter-intuitive to posting the map on the first place.. Yet Vanished continued to be a jerk, and thus we're where we are now...

Bah, honestly, forum-talk has problems, as people perceive the words differently. Vanished misunderstood the earlier comments to be rude, while they were being critical about the amount of info he posted. And even my posts many people misunderstood, as I was really just critiquing ... I do this with all my critiques.

And, with "team sage" layed down, I've already filed this under my "Troll" bucket... Tho, since Falkoner brought me up onto the table... yeah...

As for being polite ... fuck that... I like telling it like it is.. just like that guy in Dragon's Den. It's just my way of doing things. Being all "you won't have enough MATH to understand this" just confuses me.. If you've spent Hours on this map, why not spend Juuust a BIT More of your time to make a Better fucking Showcase thread to Showcase your map?? It doesn't make sense! IT's like he doesn't GIVE a damn.. other than arguing..

Hey, since it's Feed the Troll day, ima continue with a story, I've had this experience too. People being critical about my map.. Yeah, I know, it's hard to take, but sometimes, their criticisms are helpful... The one other person that I know of (other than me) who's "impolite" with their critique is ShizTheresABear. Man, did that fucker slam me.. he even did so for Templ.. Team Sage, saying that Nuke is just wretchedly off-balanced. (ironically, i didnt' change that...)

Tho it's true I may have gotten free-er with my words due to my success with Templ.. Team Sage, I was never trying to be outwardly mean or unfriendly. So, I apologize for that. And, anyway, u finally DID get me to play the map, and I thought it was decent. So Good for you! I bet not even half of these ppl've played it! (the problems I listed still stand tho...)



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Dec 10 2009, 11:13 am Forsaken Archer Post #31



Quote
Edit: And lol @ whoever reported Excalibur's post. He's a global mod, don't you guys realize that he's above everything except the final Moose-or-IP-law? Meaning, due to his global mod status, that he is allowed to decide whether or not his own post is rule-breaking or not, he's one of the people that gets a notification and has the power to deal with it... lol.
There's nothing wrong with reporting a gmod's post. I mean, even I make stupid posts from time to time.



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Dec 16 2009, 7:21 am Gigins Post #32



Is this about mapping or what? Seems excessive. But then, I've done similar long time ago. Funny. ^^



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Dec 16 2009, 12:24 pm InsolubleFluff Post #33



I laughed out loud to the tutoring math / comma comment. It was good whoever posted it.

Nice to see moose provides for SEN still.



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