Staredit Network > Forums > SC2 Melee > Topic: First melee map
First melee map
Jul 26 2010, 8:57 am
By: Alzarath  

Jul 26 2010, 8:57 am Alzarath Post #1

Praetor

So, this if my first melee map. When I say first, I mean I never made a melee map for SC1 or SC2, so please don't stab me if it sucks.

Overview:


Statistical Overview:


Bridge:


Main base/Natural expansion


Expansion:


The entire map is mirrored, so aside from the texturing, buildings, and road. It's exactly the same..
Opinions/Suggestions?

FYI, the maps borders are smaller than the map actually looks.

Oh, and I don't really have a name for it yet. I was planning on having 'Bridge' or 'Bridges' in the name for obvious reasons. Currently it's just 'Bridges' as a placeholder. Any suggestions?

Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Jul 26 2010, 2:23 pm by Artanis186.



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Jul 26 2010, 9:18 am Leeroy_Jenkins Post #2



Doesn't look too bad. Seems like it'd make for pretty interesting game play. It could probably use some more shrubbery and what-not. Keep up the good work!



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Jul 26 2010, 9:20 am Alzarath Post #3

Praetor

Quote from Leeroy_Jenkins
Doesn't look too bad. Seems like it'd make for pretty interesting game play. It could probably use some more shrubbery and what-not. Keep up the good work!

I was thinking of adding shrubs, but I just can't think of where I'd put them.
EDIT: Unless you were talking about just trees, in which case, I added s'more. ^.^
EDIT2: To explain some stuff...

The 2 Xel'Naga watch-towers have enough range to see on the bridge and are a really high priority for control, as it gives you an early warning system against ground atacks. Though it's not possible for SIege tanks to hit the bridge from Siege mode, to be fair. (Plus, I really hate tanks, so call it biased :P)
All the buildings have been pathed so you can't walk or fly into 'em, and the support beams of the bridge are made so you can't fly through 'em, for realism.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Jul 26 2010, 9:40 am by Artanis186.



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Jul 26 2010, 9:58 am Devourer Post #4

Hello

The doodad placement is looking awkward, sorry, but overall I like it :) Especially due to the bridge :awesome:
But I assume T are overpowered: they can block these ways easily and tank em.



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Jul 26 2010, 10:04 am Alzarath Post #5

Praetor

Quote from Devourer
The doodad placement is looking awkward, sorry, but overall I like it :) Especially due to the bridge :awesome:
But I assume T are overpowered: they can block these ways easily and tank em.

T is always overpowered. :\

But seriously.. Can you explain what doodads look awkward? The buildings?

Oh, and thanks. I put a lot of work into that bridge and I'm quite satisfied. ^.^

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jul 26 2010, 10:22 am by Artanis186.



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Jul 26 2010, 12:02 pm Devourer Post #6

Hello

Ya the buildings... they are high tech building like you would find in a high tech city (look at metalopolis), but only some of them on a dirt terrain doesn't look really good to be honest.
And ya, kudos for the bridge.

EDIT: How have ya done that statistic mini image with the dots which represents stuff?



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Jul 26 2010, 12:25 pm Alzarath Post #7

Praetor

Quote from Devourer
Ya the buildings... they are high tech building like you would find in a high tech city (look at metalopolis), but only some of them on a dirt terrain doesn't look really good to be honest.
And ya, kudos for the bridge.

EDIT: How have ya done that statistic mini image with the dots which represents stuff?
Manually. Gimp.

Any suggestions for better fitting buildings?



None.

Jul 26 2010, 2:20 pm 13Stallion Post #8



First things first,

The map has too few resource nodes, i would suggest adding gas to the high yield minerals and adding another expo location(near both ends of the bridge perhaps).

-A map requires at LEAST 4 bases per player. Main, Natural, Third, & High yield. Typically the high yield should be in a harder to defend area because in should offer a choice between grabbing that or your third which is easier to hold but doesnt contain high yield. Also, all resource nodes MUST have gas.

Strategically speaking, theres only 1 choke to the enemy base, so the game is most likely going to play out as if its an island map, because neither player is going to be able to successfully attack the other player via ground because the defender will always be able to set up a concave on his side of the bridge with ease. I expect air to completely dominate this map.

Also im curious, whats the rush distance?



None.

Jul 26 2010, 2:29 pm Alzarath Post #9

Praetor

Quote from 13Stallion
First things first,

The map has too few resource nodes, i would suggest adding gas to the high yield minerals and adding another expo location(near both ends of the bridge perhaps).

-A map requires at LEAST 4 bases per player. Main, Natural, Third, & High yield. Typically the high yield should be in a harder to defend area because in should offer a choice between grabbing that or your third which is easier to hold but doesnt contain high yield. Also, all resource nodes MUST have gas.

Strategically speaking, theres only 1 choke to the enemy base, so the game is most likely going to play out as if its an island map, because neither player is going to be able to successfully attack the other player via ground because the defender will always be able to set up a concave on his side of the bridge with ease. I expect air to completely dominate this map.

Also im curious, whats the rush distance?

The High-yields had gas already on there. The natural wasn't marked on the statistical overview though, I fixed that.
I updated all the pics of the map with the most recent build I have.

I'm not sure what you mean by rush distance, you mean the time it takes for a units to get from 1 side to the other? And is that in game time or real time?

EDIT: I made the 2 broken bridges normal bridges, but they have destructible debris littered atop them.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jul 26 2010, 3:21 pm by Artanis186.



None.

Jul 26 2010, 3:40 pm ImagoDeo Post #10



Quote from name:Artanis186
Quote from 13Stallion
First things first,

The map has too few resource nodes, i would suggest adding gas to the high yield minerals and adding another expo location(near both ends of the bridge perhaps).

-A map requires at LEAST 4 bases per player. Main, Natural, Third, & High yield. Typically the high yield should be in a harder to defend area because in should offer a choice between grabbing that or your third which is easier to hold but doesnt contain high yield. Also, all resource nodes MUST have gas.

Strategically speaking, theres only 1 choke to the enemy base, so the game is most likely going to play out as if its an island map, because neither player is going to be able to successfully attack the other player via ground because the defender will always be able to set up a concave on his side of the bridge with ease. I expect air to completely dominate this map.

Also im curious, whats the rush distance?

The High-yields had gas already on there. The natural wasn't marked on the statistical overview though, I fixed that.
I updated all the pics of the map with the most recent build I have.

I'm not sure what you mean by rush distance, you mean the time it takes for a units to get from 1 side to the other? And is that in game time or real time?

EDIT: I made the 2 broken bridges normal bridges, but they have destructible debris littered atop them.

The main problem with this map is that even after you've added those two bridges, there are only three paths across. No self-respecting player of gold or higher is going to willingly walk across if he knows the enemy has units on the other side, because he'll be in a bottleneck - not all his units will be able to fire, and the vast majority of the enemy units will. Besides this, Terran can park two or three siege tanks on their side of the bridges and stop any attack in its tracks. Siege tanks are just too powerful at range to be totally ignored, and if they're properly isolated with a wall of hellions and M+M in front of them, they'll shred anything that tries to cross the bridge, even banelings and speedlings. What you need to do is remove the bridges in the middle and expand the middle into a major area with several wide paths through it, so that terran can't turtle quite so easily.



None.

Jul 26 2010, 7:35 pm Alzarath Post #11

Praetor

Quote from ImagoDeo
The main problem with this map is that even after you've added those two bridges, there are only three paths across. No self-respecting player of gold or higher is going to willingly walk across if he knows the enemy has units on the other side, because he'll be in a bottleneck - not all his units will be able to fire, and the vast majority of the enemy units will. Besides this, Terran can park two or three siege tanks on their side of the bridges and stop any attack in its tracks. Siege tanks are just too powerful at range to be totally ignored, and if they're properly isolated with a wall of hellions and M+M in front of them, they'll shred anything that tries to cross the bridge, even banelings and speedlings. What you need to do is remove the bridges in the middle and expand the middle into a major area with several wide paths through it, so that terran can't turtle quite so easily.

But the bridge was the center-point of the concept. :(

EDIT: Because I'm a pest, I've decided to look for a work-around over altering the bridge. :P

So, I removed the 2 bridges on the left and right and replaced them with cliffs coming from the bases. My hopes are, this will allow players to check for units down there and attack them at will. This way people wont be rushing blindly and it'll be more difficult to barricade your side of the bridge.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jul 26 2010, 7:57 pm by Artanis186.



None.

Jul 26 2010, 9:30 pm ImagoDeo Post #12



Quote from name:Artanis186
Quote from ImagoDeo
The main problem with this map is that even after you've added those two bridges, there are only three paths across. No self-respecting player of gold or higher is going to willingly walk across if he knows the enemy has units on the other side, because he'll be in a bottleneck - not all his units will be able to fire, and the vast majority of the enemy units will. Besides this, Terran can park two or three siege tanks on their side of the bridges and stop any attack in its tracks. Siege tanks are just too powerful at range to be totally ignored, and if they're properly isolated with a wall of hellions and M+M in front of them, they'll shred anything that tries to cross the bridge, even banelings and speedlings. What you need to do is remove the bridges in the middle and expand the middle into a major area with several wide paths through it, so that terran can't turtle quite so easily.

But the bridge was the center-point of the concept. :(

EDIT: Because I'm a pest, I've decided to look for a work-around over altering the bridge. :P

So, I removed the 2 bridges on the left and right and replaced them with cliffs coming from the bases. My hopes are, this will allow players to check for units down there and attack them at will. This way people wont be rushing blindly and it'll be more difficult to barricade your side of the bridge.

Screenshots please?

I suggest that if you want to keep the bridge, make it double or even trible-wide. Narrow spots that must be moved through are too exploitable for Terran. Ergo if you have either more spots to move through or wider spots to move through, it's not quite so imba for Terran.



None.

Jul 27 2010, 5:15 am Alzarath Post #13

Praetor

Quote from ImagoDeo
Screenshots please?

I suggest that if you want to keep the bridge, make it double or even trible-wide. Narrow spots that must be moved through are too exploitable for Terran. Ergo if you have either more spots to move through or wider spots to move through, it's not quite so imba for Terran.

Well, how about I make it a double bridge? I feel increasing its width further will continue to make it uglier. The textures are vector after all, so it can't really be pretty with constant stretching.
Screenshot of what I was referring to:


Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jul 27 2010, 5:54 am by Artanis186.



None.

Jul 27 2010, 5:02 pm ImagoDeo Post #14



Just so long as it's significantly wider than it is now, I think it'll be fine. It's not likely to be balanced, but then again SC2 has a long way yet to go and it's not unlikely that we'll need new ideas like this if we're going to find the right formulas for balanced maps.



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