Prediction: Shitstorm or topic locked as soon as a mod sees this, either way.

*Sits down with a drink and popcorn.

Actually:

It's not about owning it. It's about respecting the creator's wishes and not changing it in ways they didn't approve of.

No protection.
I honestly don't care who's name is on a map. I'll play it and have fun. I don't care if someone steals my map and puts they're name on it. I made it and I play it. If they edit it, and ruin it, I'll still have the original to play for myself and with friends. My friends will know I made it, and they really will be the only ones who will really care that I made it. I enjoyed making it, and learned lots from making it. Found new systems, glitches, neat triggers, and new concepts by redoing lots of things. For the past year I've not been giving myself credit for making a map. I don't get payed for making maps, and making maps will not give me anything beneficial other than a learning experience and a good time.

(Well I haven't been making maps for the past year, but I will not be giving myself credit to myself anymore for map making or mod making. The only credit that I'm giving is for clan that I'm in.) So when starcraft II comes out I'll be making maps without giving myself credit. I will only be giving credit to the clan that I'm in; Clan Orig Production.


Protect the maps, or don't; Your choice. Sue the "map stealers" or stop bitching about it.

Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Jun 23 2008, 1:05 am by Test.

It's not just the map stealers. Anyone unprotecting a map is disrespecting the map creator's wishes. If YOU don't care about YOUR maps being protected, fine. But don't force your decision on everyone else. That's like saying "I don't mind if people come into my home randomly, and you shouldn't either. So, I'm going to break into your home. Sue me or quit bitching." The only differences are the level of importance, and that someone can actually be punished for breaking into your home.

I NEVER said everyone should think my way. I posted a post of "IMO" that's what this topic is for. Allowing people to see how other people think.

"Disrespecting" ?? Lol. No. They have 100% permission to do so. Why don't you go read all of the info Blizzard has sent to you when you installed starcraft. The Terms of Use and everything. Nowhere does it say " You may not edit someone elses map. "

There is, however, a rule on sen saying no map stealing. I think. So as long as someone steals a map and doesn't post it here, they are fine. Clan Orig also has a no map stealing policy. So, I am not a map thief.

OMG I just edited racoon city, and put my name on it! Lol!

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jun 23 2008, 1:15 am by Test.

A mapper who protects his map obviously doesn't want people opening it. So you're disrespecting his wishes. I don't see how you could possibly try to argue that you aren't. Having permission from Blizzard, and having the mapper agree that it's okay are two entirely different things.

Is anything that isn't against the rules fine? It's not against the law to laugh at the loved ones of someone who has recently died. Does that mean it's okay? You can even go to another country and slaughter puppies if you want to. Is that okay?

Believe it or not, sticking your tongue out at someone is not respectful, even if there isn't a legislation dealing with that. 'Respect' and 'Lawful Permission' have nothing to do with each other. Anyone who cannot see that just lost a great deal of respect. And, hey, they didn't do anything illegal!

For me, it's as simple as this: If the person made the map, they should choose whether to protect or not. I'd protect, but that not useful anymore only because that {insert multiple heavy profanities} LegacyWeapon created OSMAP. IF SOMEONE WASTED TIME TO BRING THIS MAP, WHY DO YOU THINK YOU HAVE THE MORAL RIGHT TO DO ANYTHING WITH IT EXCEPT WHAT HE CREATED IT FOR? If the damn creator WANTED YOU TO STARE AT HOW IT WORKS, IT WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN PROTECTED!

... Hah, I'm still pissed on the issue. How much time has passed? A year? Two?

I don't know. It pisses me off too. I'm glad to have someone debating on my side here.

I don't see how anyone can possibly argue that unprotecting a map is morally correct. The map maker put in his time and effort to bring you something fun to play, and people don't give a shit what he wants for his creation. What if he hadn't created it at all? Then you wouldn't have anything to unprotect and edit, or anything to play. Great. I wish people would show some respect for the creation's of others.

I can do whatever the hell I want with a map and disrespect whoever I want.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jun 23 2008, 1:32 am by devilesk. Reason: FUCK YOU LULZ

Sure. But that's why everyone hates you . See how that works? Devilesk's argument isn't that what he's doing is moral, it's that he doesn't care. A step in our direction.

Does anyone ever stop to think that there are bigger problems in the world than the name on a map?

If you have put a lot of work into a map, and you can look at the finished project, isn't that good enough? If you take the time to distribute the original version of the map (to your friends and such), if a fraud version starts going around it shouldn't be much of a problem.

Hey, I'm plenty pissed at Bush too. These problems, however, are much closer to home and I can affect how they turn out. At least a bit.

To everyone who says that unprotection can't hurt and that the original will always prevail against fraud copies, take a look on the game LOAP on WCIII. 0% of all versions hosted are the original, 90% of all versions hosted have a superpower character such as 'Ninja' or 'God' or 'Bill Gates' or 'Satan' or 'Death'' with infinite stats so the host can kill everyone else.

For an SEN, sort of limited map (not built for Battle.net) I'd go with Unprotected

For a battle net map, I would protect, so that there aren't a million different copies floating around because someone wanted to change it some way. Not to mention they usually make your map seem less professional by changing the title to FINAL VERSION RIGGED FIXED Perfect!!!. Or add secrets to give them an advantage.

Of course this won't stop people, but it will seriously decrease the amount. And also like you said, if someone really wants to use it to learn more, they can. And from my experienced, these people are a lot more willing to go through the trouble than those who just want to give marines 500 life.

I don't care

Unprotection gives people what they want. The majority wants to play rigged shit so let them. If they don't want to play rigged maps then they host the unrigged version. For example with some of that LOTR shit if people start dling they won't play it, they'll go WTF WHY AM I DLING. As an experiment I once tried to steal one of those maps and spread it and when I tried to host it no one would download it.

AND YOU FAIL BECAUSE YOU USE A WC3 EXAMPLE. THIS IS SC.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jun 23 2008, 1:52 am by devilesk. Reason: YOU BLOW

Or they could just ask. If someone wanted to know something, they could just post on SEN, and 99% of all that they want that has been done before will be unveiled. I'll also say that for 'learning purposes', LegacyWeapon could've made a 'map viewer' that doesn't actually unprotect it.

BUT HE DIDN'T SO GG.

I CAN DO WHATEVER I WANT WITH A MAP LA LA LA LA LA

And recreating a map is a waste of time. Unprotecting and editing is much easier.

And this topic is a waste of time because these arguments have been gone over 100000000 times before. No one is saying anything new. And the fact doesn't change that I CAN STILL DO WHATEVER I WANT LULZ. OSMAP EXISTS.

I don't see how it isn't ok.

Also you cannot assume that protection means the mapper does not want you in the map at all, ever, for any reason at all. I am pretty sure almost everything in StarCraft has been discovered and been battered to death. What more can you learn from a map? It does no harm to anyone to look in a map just to see what is done behind the scenes. I am a mapper, I *somewhat* protect maps (I used to actually use protection, now I just use a seemingly cryptic style to most.) I have never protected to keep everyone out. I've always had the mindest that if someone wants to take the time to open up my map and trudge through my seemingly nonexistant conventions, I would actually feel honored for them to even consider opening it (which is why I don't actually protect anymore.) Yes, I have had the fear that some idiot would go in and spam it with units and rig it up, it was also done in through that fear. However, I'm pretty sure none of my maps would ever become big enough for anyone to even think about doing that so I don't even bother worrying anymore.

You cannot assume ever why people do or don't protect. You can know for yourself, maybe know for some friends, but not for everyone. If you really don't want people to edit your map or even look at it (which, in my opinion, is total bullshit), you could specify it. It may not keep out certain dishonest people, but they are likely to be annoying shits that nobody cares about anyway.


Ya.
Side A: *states something*
Side B: *counters*
Side A: "Didn't you read what I just said?" *restates*
Side B: *counters with the same arguments*

And how many times have you been banned from SEN and Maplantis?


That may be good enough for you. For me it's not even about the credit, it's the fact that someone else would try to steal that credit. That disgusts me. Or even just change the map in some way that it wasn't meant to be changed. People often think "oh this would be better if this random feature was different", and the creator might not have thought of that. But in my experience, the creator has thought of it, and decided against it for some reason.


Well, devilesk is pretty much on the side of protection, because no one respects his opinion, and his opinion is in favor of unprotection.


Or in the case of the map S.W.A.T. by Mathrix(U). It wasn't changed, but his name was taken off of it. Whenever I saw that game publicly hosted, I saw some map stealing noob's name on it. I actually thought he made it until I talked to Mathrix one day.