Staredit Network > Forums > SC2 Melee > Topic: (2)Shrine
(2)Shrine
Jun 29 2010, 6:09 pm
By: ImagoDeo  

Jun 29 2010, 6:09 pm ImagoDeo Post #1



Update in progress.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Aug 28 2010, 9:48 pm by ImagoDeo.



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Jun 29 2010, 10:06 pm UnholyUrine Post #2



Wow!

I reallly like this one!

I think the ONLY thing that you could improve on is to decorate the area behind the nats. Everything else, conceptually, is really good!
You should decorate this a bit more and try posting it on Teamliquid or something.

@Perceived problems: Recently, I've been playing zerg, and it is super hard to get a good defense up early if the choke point is too far away from the base due to creep requirements. I'm not sure if this is a big, big deal, tho. You can also decrease the general size by adding random shit, like curtained off areas in the main/rush paths, or doodad some areas up to make them cool.



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Jun 30 2010, 12:19 am ImagoDeo Post #3



See first post for updates.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Aug 28 2010, 9:48 pm by ImagoDeo.



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Jun 30 2010, 1:45 am ImagoDeo Post #4



See first post for updates.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Aug 28 2010, 9:49 pm by ImagoDeo.



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Jun 30 2010, 5:51 am Syphon Post #5



The rush distance is ludicrously long.

Very Terran favourable in that you can easily trap your opponent in their base with reverse walls on the high ground middle and drops on the useless high terrain around it.

Terran unfavourable in that walling in is very hard.

Protoss favourable in that colossi and stalkers would destroy anything else on the ground.



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Jun 30 2010, 3:56 pm ImagoDeo Post #6



Quote from Syphon
The rush distance is ludicrously long.

Very Terran favourable in that you can easily trap your opponent in their base with reverse walls on the high ground middle and drops on the useless high terrain around it.

Terran unfavourable in that walling in is very hard.

Protoss favourable in that colossi and stalkers would destroy anything else on the ground.

Ludicrously long? This from the guy who made http://www.staredit.net/topic/11620/ ?

...yes, it is a touch terran favorable. But did you not see the destroyable rocks behind the nat? That's a viable option. Plus, if a Terran's trapping you in, pull out some air vehicles, or grab a few DTs to slice up his siege tanks.

I'm going to make a few modifications and then we'll see.



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Jun 30 2010, 9:55 pm Syphon Post #7



Quote from ImagoDeo
Quote from Syphon
The rush distance is ludicrously long.

Very Terran favourable in that you can easily trap your opponent in their base with reverse walls on the high ground middle and drops on the useless high terrain around it.

Terran unfavourable in that walling in is very hard.

Protoss favourable in that colossi and stalkers would destroy anything else on the ground.

Ludicrously long? This from the guy who made http://www.staredit.net/topic/11620/ ?

...yes, it is a touch terran favorable. But did you not see the destroyable rocks behind the nat? That's a viable option. Plus, if a Terran's trapping you in, pull out some air vehicles, or grab a few DTs to slice up his siege tanks.

I'm going to make a few modifications and then we'll see.

It's only slightly shorter than Derelict at first, after the doors are open the distance is much longer.

When I mean 'trapping you' I mean bunker/turret/tanks.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Jun 30 2010, 10:01 pm by Syphon.



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Jul 1 2010, 5:31 am ImagoDeo Post #8



Quote from Syphon
It's only slightly shorter than Derelict at first, after the doors are open the distance is much longer.

When I mean 'trapping you' I mean bunker/turret/tanks.

*sigh* Rushing =/= stop to kill rocks. Ergo, the distance on my map is 'slightly [significantly] shorter' than on Derelict.

Secondly, I have never seen someone trap an opponent in with a bunker/turret/tank thing like what you proposed. Only a negligent enemy would allow that to happen to him. And even if he did, he can break out of his back door and expand and push from behind the wall/trap/whatever.



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Jul 1 2010, 7:10 am Syphon Post #9



Quote from ImagoDeo
Quote from Syphon
It's only slightly shorter than Derelict at first, after the doors are open the distance is much longer.

When I mean 'trapping you' I mean bunker/turret/tanks.

*sigh* Rushing =/= stop to kill rocks. Ergo, the distance on my map is 'slightly [significantly] shorter' than on Derelict.

Secondly, I have never seen someone trap an opponent in with a bunker/turret/tank thing like what you proposed. Only a negligent enemy would allow that to happen to him. And even if he did, he can break out of his back door and expand and push from behind the wall/trap/whatever.

"Rush distance" just means the distance between bases. Late game pushes are still hindered by absurdly long rush distances.

No, it's not significantly shorter. Put them through SC2MapAnalyzer. Derelict is something like 212 and Shrine is about 204.

I've seen it happen to WhiteRa on Metalopolis. I don't think you know anyone better than him, or was he being 'negligent'



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Jul 1 2010, 7:29 pm ImagoDeo Post #10



Quote from Syphon
Quote from ImagoDeo
Quote from Syphon
It's only slightly shorter than Derelict at first, after the doors are open the distance is much longer.

When I mean 'trapping you' I mean bunker/turret/tanks.

*sigh* Rushing =/= stop to kill rocks. Ergo, the distance on my map is 'slightly [significantly] shorter' than on Derelict.

Secondly, I have never seen someone trap an opponent in with a bunker/turret/tank thing like what you proposed. Only a negligent enemy would allow that to happen to him. And even if he did, he can break out of his back door and expand and push from behind the wall/trap/whatever.

"Rush distance" just means the distance between bases. Late game pushes are still hindered by absurdly long rush distances.

No, it's not significantly shorter. Put them through SC2MapAnalyzer. Derelict is something like 212 and Shrine is about 204.

I've seen it happen to WhiteRa on Metalopolis. I don't think you know anyone better than him, or was he being 'negligent'

I don't want this to turn into a flamefest. So let's get some things straight - ok, base to base distance is pretty big. Terran contains might be a little too powerful. I accept that these are problems. The trouble is that you haven't offered any solutions. Sure, I can find some myself, but if I don't get input I might just make the problem worse.

Thanks in advance.

A couple of side notes - yes, WhiteRa might have been negligent. No one is perfect.

Also, I'm having trouble getting SC2MapAnalyzer to work. The manual mentioned something about an executable file, but I can't find it. I'd appreciate any help you could give me.



None.

Jul 1 2010, 7:38 pm Syphon Post #11



Quote from ImagoDeo
Quote from Syphon
Quote from ImagoDeo
Quote from Syphon
It's only slightly shorter than Derelict at first, after the doors are open the distance is much longer.

When I mean 'trapping you' I mean bunker/turret/tanks.

*sigh* Rushing =/= stop to kill rocks. Ergo, the distance on my map is 'slightly [significantly] shorter' than on Derelict.

Secondly, I have never seen someone trap an opponent in with a bunker/turret/tank thing like what you proposed. Only a negligent enemy would allow that to happen to him. And even if he did, he can break out of his back door and expand and push from behind the wall/trap/whatever.

"Rush distance" just means the distance between bases. Late game pushes are still hindered by absurdly long rush distances.

No, it's not significantly shorter. Put them through SC2MapAnalyzer. Derelict is something like 212 and Shrine is about 204.

I've seen it happen to WhiteRa on Metalopolis. I don't think you know anyone better than him, or was he being 'negligent'

I don't want this to turn into a flamefest. So let's get some things straight - ok, base to base distance is pretty big. Terran contains might be a little too powerful. I accept that these are problems. The trouble is that you haven't offered any solutions. Sure, I can find some myself, but if I don't get input I might just make the problem worse.

Thanks in advance.

A couple of side notes - yes, WhiteRa might have been negligent. No one is perfect.

Also, I'm having trouble getting SC2MapAnalyzer to work. The manual mentioned something about an executable file, but I can't find it. I'd appreciate any help you could give me.

In the .rar there should just be a file name sc2mapanalyzer.exe - double clicking it opens a command line program that automatically outputs stats for all maps in the same directory.



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