Staredit Network > Forums > SC1 Melee Map Projects > Topic: (2)Spear1.4 (UPDATED!)
(2)Spear1.4 (UPDATED!)
Feb 24 2010, 12:57 pm
By: Excalibur  

Feb 24 2010, 12:57 pm Excalibur Post #1

The sword and the faith

Spear (Currently 1.4)



Download

Still have decorating to do.

Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Feb 26 2010, 3:50 am by Sexcalibear.




SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
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The sword and the faith.

:ex:
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Feb 24 2010, 12:59 pm BeDazed Post #2



I like.



None.

Feb 24 2010, 1:28 pm Excalibur Post #3

The sword and the faith

Updated, deco still not done.




SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
-------------------------
The sword and the faith.

:ex:
Sector 12
My stream, live PC building and tech discussion.

Feb 24 2010, 2:02 pm BeDazed Post #4



I don't like too much deco in maps. They are usually distracting, and works as a path blocker. MOST of the times.



None.

Feb 24 2010, 2:12 pm Excalibur Post #5

The sword and the faith

I was planning to ask one of the BWMN deco experts for help if any of them happen to be active.




SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
-------------------------
The sword and the faith.

:ex:
Sector 12
My stream, live PC building and tech discussion.

Feb 24 2010, 11:03 pm Aristocrat Post #6



You like unbuildable terrain don't you :P.

Deco should be done with sprites whenever possible. Doodads replace underlying terrain and cause problems with vision and hit% that can give unfair advantages to certain positions.

It's okay for the most part, minus these things:
-Difficult 3rd gas for Zerg
-"invincible tank" problem at corners but I hardly see that as an issue in most games.
-Too many min-only bases making this Z-disadvantageous.
-Your corner expansions strongly resembles the ones here. No accusatory finger-pointing from me, just saying.
-Terran can push 2 feet and have map control due to the cliff layout.



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Feb 25 2010, 12:05 am Excalibur Post #7

The sword and the faith

-Difficult 3rd gas for Zerg
With the map being so open and unbuildable as well as a lot of the expos being very hard to defend against muta, I'm going to say not an issue.

-Your corner expansions strongly resembles the ones here. No accusatory finger-pointing from me, just saying.
Yeah that and 100 other maps. :P

-Terran can push 2 feet and have map control due to the cliff layout.
I disagree, there are plety of ramps and options.




SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
-------------------------
The sword and the faith.

:ex:
Sector 12
My stream, live PC building and tech discussion.

Feb 25 2010, 12:38 am Aristocrat Post #8



Quote from name:Sexcalibear
-Difficult 3rd gas for Zerg
With the map being so open and unbuildable as well as a lot of the expos being very hard to defend against muta, I'm going to say not an issue.

Zerg can't run on 2base forever; I don't see *any* zerg having enough gas to run hive-tech builds on this map and they pretty much have to all-in with mutas every single time.

(How does unbuildable terrain have to do with this at all? If anything, the unbuildable terrain makes it impossible to take the corners since Z can't sunken it well, exacerbating the defect's impact.)

Play a game as terran on this and you see how difficult it is for a P army to even get close to the terran here. Tanks in the middle dominate the bottom and force the protoss to engage the terran ball. There is *zero* room to flank the terran push. Normally I do not scream "TANK IMBA LOL" but a push through the middle is extremely strong here.

P.S. As for the corner expo, I haven't seen another map with that kind of 2x ramp facing in the same direction; would you mind redirecting me to one?



None.

Feb 25 2010, 12:52 am BeDazed Post #9



You can probably say Zerg is done for if it can't get a 3rd gas.



None.

Feb 25 2010, 2:50 am OlimarandLouie Post #10



I'm just throwing out an idea here... but what if there were a gas only expo? Say in the middle, with 3000 gas?



None.

Feb 25 2010, 3:13 am Dem0n Post #11

ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ

No. You never have gas expoes. Never.



Memes gather, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness. I am the memer on the walls. I am the shield that guards the realms of memes. I pledge my life and honor to the Meme's Watch, for this meme and all the memes to come.

Feb 25 2010, 4:11 am Excalibur Post #12

The sword and the faith

Quote from OlimarandLouie
I'm just throwing out an idea here... but what if there were a gas only expo? Say in the middle, with 3000 gas?
Quote from name:Dem0nS1ayer
No. You never have gas expoes. Never.

This. You make another post like that Oli and you're in trouble.

See
Quote from Sticky
1. Do I know what I am talking about?
-If you have no idea how to make a balanced melee yourself, you really don't have much business trying to tell someone else how to do it. Rather than give bad advice that will only hurt, it's better to be silent and let someone else do the job. If you aren't sure, say so, not everyone's an expert, but if you aren't, do not claim to be.





SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
-------------------------
The sword and the faith.

:ex:
Sector 12
My stream, live PC building and tech discussion.

Feb 25 2010, 4:25 am Jack Post #13

>be faceless void >mfw I have no face

Quote from name:Sexcalibear
Quote from OlimarandLouie
I'm just throwing out an idea here... but what if there were a gas only expo? Say in the middle, with 3000 gas?
Quote from name:Dem0nS1ayer
No. You never have gas expoes. Never.

This. You make another post like that Oli and you're in trouble.

See
Quote from Sticky
1. Do I know what I am talking about?
-If you have no idea how to make a balanced melee yourself, you really don't have much business trying to tell someone else how to do it. Rather than give bad advice that will only hurt, it's better to be silent and let someone else do the job. If you aren't sure, say so, not everyone's an expert, but if you aren't, do not claim to be.
It says in the guide that if you have a gas-only, it's to be only one geyser. So does the guide need updating to say 'No gas-only'?

Also, why are gas-only's a bad idea?



Red classic.

"In short, their absurdities are so extreme that it is painful even to quote them."

Feb 25 2010, 4:32 am Aristocrat Post #14



Gas only expansions are not standard and benefit zerg more than any other race. It would not actually be a horrid idea for balance, it is just... weird. Plus, many builds now depend on the min/gas ratios achieved by mining both minerals and gas at an expansion, and gas only expos have to be balanced with min-onlys for players to not have out of whack resources late to mid game, at which point it might as well be combined into one expo.



None.

Feb 25 2010, 4:52 am Excalibur Post #15

The sword and the faith

I have yet to see a gas only used in a way that was both balanced and effective.




SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
-------------------------
The sword and the faith.

:ex:
Sector 12
My stream, live PC building and tech discussion.

Feb 26 2010, 3:50 am Excalibur Post #16

The sword and the faith

Updated!




SEN Global Moderator and Resident Zealot
-------------------------
The sword and the faith.

:ex:
Sector 12
My stream, live PC building and tech discussion.

Feb 26 2010, 4:09 am Super Duper Post #17



Vultures on this map.... V.V
Tankable islands.
That's all I can see for now. I'll get back to this map when my mass insomina wears off.



None.

Feb 28 2010, 1:04 am Aristocrat Post #18



Once again there's the problem of the expos at the middle being unobtainable unless you have map control, but it's to be expected. If you made corner expos choked by cliff rather than ramp and made it smaller, zerg can viably take it as 3rd gas.

Pathing for the main-nat is... less than optimal. Not to mention different for both bases. It's a quick 30 second fix by moving the choke up a tiny bit, though.

EDIT> Pathing for the middle is... no offense, shitty. I don't think most people would bother destroying the temples anyways.

EDIT2> If your chokes were any smaller those critters could be a real pain.



None.

Feb 28 2010, 1:31 am Super Duper Post #19



'Kay, back.
Tanks on this map are so win. Huddle a tank in the top right edge of the map and that expo is useless.
3 Tanks behind the Minonly = Win. 3 tanks can take out all the probes before reinforcements come.
Like I said, tankable islands. But this cant be avoided, so... Im just going to ignore that.
Honestly, every expansion on that map can be decimated with tanks. I dont know if the concept is Tank Opness, because it sure seems like that. If you think "Oh, other races can just harass too", then thats kinda wrong because Imbalance + Imbalance =/= Balance.
Also, see where you put the rocky ground behind the nat? I would remove that if I were you. If you dont, people will just have to make 2 pylons or 2 depots to block that. And thats annoying.



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