That doesn't have to do with what he was talking about. In that scripture a man puled out before cuming in his wife. The anti-gay stuff is all over the place, but started in sodom. The town didn't like this god-fearing jewish outsider, and threatened to gang-rape him. That was perfered method of punishment. So he fled, god and beat the gay out of the town with fire. Leviticus says that when a man lies with a man it is an abomination to god, and that they must be stoned.

And nothing in the new testament says "Oh yeh, stop stoning gay people."

Edit: I don't know why my posts are attaching things...

Attachments:

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Mar 6 2008, 2:20 am by ClansAreForGays.

First of all, I am not even sure i'd call homosexuality a sin, I still question it. I'm only speaking assuming it is a sin. But more importantly, when I refer to homosexuals, I refer to people who naturally love people of the same gender, people who've during puberty grew natural interests in the same gender. I read an article in Time Magazine where they've interviewed many gay teenagers and alot of them have said such things. These are the people who want to spend the rest of their lives with their loving spouse. I would not mind letting these people be able to have all sorts of benefits financially and such as any straight couple would. I cannot see this as a sin; actions may be a different issue but what I'm referring to are not actions.

However from what I've seen, many "homos" are not like that. My friend pointed this out but it seems like alot of gay couples are just extremely sex-starved. Walk down any Gay street in some major cities (indicated with rainbow flags or something) and all you see are sex shops with models of males with erected penises. Our city has had a couple gay parades and all it was was just a sex parade. IMO I doubt these people truly are attracted to the same gender, but like I've said many times I have no problem with that (at least when it just comes to the 'homosexuality' part). Me and my friends were walking down this one street and happened to pass by two guys kissing each other. Then one of them approached my roomate and was like "Hey you want a kiss too? I can make it really good for you." This is what I see to be controversial when it comes to "homosexuals" and their actions, this is also where people can make references to the Bible.
So as for those type of people, the only sin I personally see is just the fact that they're so sex starved and are willing to do just about.. anything. Homosexuality (both feelings and actions) are completely irrelevant when I observed such things. This is also why I kept saying that if what these homosexuals are doing is sinful, then they aren't any different from us.

"man lies with a man it is an abomination to god" 'Cause he's wasting the strong Jewish seed.

And like I said, those quotes and passages are used by people when describing that these actions are sinful.

A reoccuring theme in this debate is people pointing out the worst forms of everything.

90% of christians are fine, the 10% give the rest a bad name.

90% of atheists are fine, once again the 10% give the rest a bad name.

And the same goes with homosexuality etc.

People, stop mentioning this shit.


Just a side note on what millenium army said about gays, animals have proven to have the ability to be gay as well and atleast I think that makes your "sex starvation" theory untrue. You may respond if you want, but I will not respond back, I am not going to get in a stupid argument.

Id like to see the atheists try to explain Criss Angel to me. If you ever seen that, you'll believe. That shit is real.

Who told you that?
Once again, the wasting of seed is in Genesis 38:10 when Onan pulls out. And we can only guess that they believed the seed was limited. Nothing in the bible actually says it was, that type of thinking was seen mostly in early Africa.

It's clear to anyone that has read the bible that god hates the lust that might exist between 2 men(or 2 women). That stuff is in Genesis 19(Also has some hot dad on daughter action).

Criss Angel video edits.

So I have no influence over debate because I'm young? WTF? I understand theoretical shit and so on, so plz dun juje meh

Many people are ageist, and they have good reason to be so. It's a fact of life.

Evolution does not contradict Christian beliefs, only Human evolution, you can easily say that when the Bible says that God created the Earth in 6 days that it is not literal, especially since later in the Bible it says that one of God's days is 1000 of our years, but should we take that literally either, God could have used Evolution.


I can quote several places in the Bible where it specifically speaks against homosexuality, here's just a few of them:

Leviticus 18:22 - "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."

Isaiah 3:9 - "The shew of their countenance doth witness against them; and they declare their sin as Sodom, they hide it not. Woe unto their soul! For they have rewarded evil unto themselves" (Referring to Sodom from Gen. 19: 5)

Romans 1:26-27 - "26: For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burning in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet."

1 Timothy 1:10 - "For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine."

There are many more references, including:
1 Corinthians 6:9, Jude 1:7, Isaiah 3:9, Ezekiel 16:50, 2 Timothy 3:3, and 2 Peter 2:1

The Bible says that homosexuality is a sin on many occasions, and makes it clear that it is a sin.


And many people who are naturally attracted lead natural lives, where they end up marrying a woman and have a happy life, even if they are never truly attracted to the woman, it's hard, but it's the best way to serve the Lord, notice that there is not a single homosexual who is really trying to be faithful? Maybe if they tried, but it still seems a sin to me, and while they have had studies proving it may be natural, the vast majority of homosexuals have had something twist their minds that made them that way, even if they deny it.
That's why I have a problem with homosexuality in general, because most of them are not even doing it because they can't help it, it's like you said, most are just so wrong that they would do anything for sex.


Does that mean we have to act like animals? We are sophisticated beings, not stupid animals, has there been any cases found for more intelligent animals, such as dolphins or monkeys? The animals found doing it are only doing it for the pleasure, not because they feel an attraction to the same-sex, and the same animals will also have sex with the opposite sex, unlike many homosexual humans.

Yes, there are homosexuals, but do they have to be so public about it? Keep something like that to yourself, try to blend in, we don't need or want them to be acting all homosexual around us, they can do that in the privacy of their homes.

What the fuck is wrong with doing things for pleasure, may I ask? I don't want the arbitrary answer relating to "Because God says so", please.


People have the freedom to be as private or unprivate as they want (within the law). It's not your job to decide, nor is it your job to speak for other people with your 'we'. GAH.

It's getting annoying how people are saying things like "Stop Complaining" or things like get over it. A forum is a place where people discuss so if you don't have any good input, gtfo? Anyways some of these statements going against what ideas like mine is really redundant. Writing something in a different way can really change what the real meanings was.

@Falk. Yes, bonobo chimps.

NO U

I'd like to quote Criss Angel here.

"no one has the ability, that I'm aware of, to do anything supernatural, psychic, talk to the dead. And that was what I said I was going to do with "Phenomenon." If somebody goes on that show and claims to have supernatural psychic ability, I'm going to bust them live and on television."

I intend to convert to Judaism later in life, it is the religion I enjoy. It is a religion that allows and even gives credence to questioning the almighty (Abraham questioning God over the destruction of Sodom and Gommorrah, etc.), and has always valued education over blind observance and the pricelessness of human life. To me, the idea that worshiping or praying makes someone "stupid" is about as utterly retarded as it gets. Not only do a lot of religions, particularly modern branches, discourage "blind following", they also encourage the education and fair treatment of other human beings.

Now, there are plenty of backwards churches still lumbering around with the baggage of racism, sexism, and homophobia, but those are an over-spoken minority in the Western world. Here, you claim that atheism is a "superior" philosophy, yet so often it is as backwards and intolerant as the religions it rebukes.

I believe to hurt no man who has not hurt me, not to judge a person before they speak, but I believe the judgment is pretty obvious here: If you're an atheist and you believe that philosophy makes you superior to someone else, you're an asshole.

I don't wish to talk with any of the other's here, no one has ever convinced someone out of atheism or out of faith, but this comment he made was absolutely ridiculous.

... best use of the meme I've ever seen.

Yep, or natural lives like getting with a partner of the appropriate sex, rather than following conventions. ;o

lolololololol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0vGamcQIYs
... >_>
Also, lookup Bonobo apes.

Because you know all about the sexuality of the people who don't talk about it, right? =P

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Mar 7 2008, 12:22 pm by EzDay281.

http://www.godhateshomophobes.com/video-homosexual-dolphins.php
lol, there you go. 2 examples that you just randomly picked out of your head. We have evidence of both being gay.
And you say the fact that they do it for pleasure makes it ok. Straight sex between animals is also driven by pleasure.

Falkner's Big Book of Facts:
Homos don't even try to be faithful.
Only the stupid animals are gay.
Gays are too lazy to atleast try and fight their gayness.
The VAST majority of gays were manipulated into being gay!(Even if they deny it, trust me I know)
*Still not as bad as Ejac's book*

I expect more from you wilhelm. A good deal of aethists were born chirstian, until they met someone who wasn't. at 10, I met an older girl that seemed to have a good head on her shoulders. I mentioned god for a second, and her sister told me she didn't believe in god. She snapped at her sister and told her to drop it. But I was like "Wow, your stupid. Why do you hate god? Do you actually want to go to hell? What's wrong with you! JUST BELIEVE IN GOD!" Then she politely sat me down and asked me questions that I couldn't answer. Ofcourse I didn't change right there, but she planted a seed in my mind. It wasn't until years later that I was finally able to see god as a fairy tale.
So yes, what we say has an impact.

And why didn't you know the answers? Because you were not faithful enough. You don't get answers unless you look for them.


A reason why we shouldn't be homosexual, we are not animals.