But the community there is horrible, so much that there's only pro's who play the regular matches, and pubs who can only play the bot matches. Pubs can't do anything because if they play horribly or announce they are new, everyone leaves. Cue "No room for any beginners" sign that was put as the same in Counter Strike leagues. (In counter strike, if you didn't have a 1.5 k/D ratio in some servers, they automatically ban you.)

My point exactly. There are natural problems with the map, im not saying make a plain symmetrical straight map that couldnt possibly have a problem, but hey. A little diversity in your game saying HAY GUIZE, COMBAT YOU LOVE ON NEW FIELDS just sounds better than "hay guize, same old map, just some new guys"

Yeah this is just not even remotely true, sorry. People can be harsh but there are tons of new players who get along fine.

Not to keep this going, but I remember reading that LoL has around 15 million subscribers. Granted those include multiple accounts and whatnot, but that's still a high number. I haven't found any concrete number regarding total number of DotA players worldwide, but I have found a few sites with estimates around 10 million. I think its hard to say which one has a larger community unless you have actual proof that it is one or the other.

I was actually going to point this out, but I felt like I was going to get attacked for even bothering.

Btw WoW dropped to 7mil. Just throwing that out there.

I bet that the DotA community puts in more hours. Those accounts can just be the ones people used to test the game and then just leave it, which many have done. I bet China has more DotA players than there are LoL accounts anyway. Then how many of LoL's players are going to flat out leave it for DOTA2? At least 10-20% easy.

Also:

That means roughly about ~20 million downloads. Same as accounts. This was like a year ago. http://www.playdota.com/forums/blogs/icefrog/page4/

There are also about 4 ladder sites that track how good a DotA team is, then a coalition of sites that use bots to host games on WC3:TFT that track and share in-game stats that are recorded. LoL has... Riot's Elo system?

Post has been edited 4 time(s), last time on Aug 23 2011, 5:15 am by LoveLess.

This article was from a year and a half ago, before DOTA2 was even mentioned.


Im sure things have considerably changed, considering people will be preparing to make the transfer from DOTA 1 to 2, if those people even want to that is. Id imagine like SEN, some people will be clingy to their older game, or find the new one a lot less attractive once they actually play it and resume playing the old one. And lets not forget the current setup, all the bots and such. People arent just going to throw everything away just because a game is coming out.

Next thing, about asia:


These statistics are from July 26, 2011. Directly below it includes this.


League is packing in quite a few players for 2 years of time, considering DOTA has been out for quite a few years. Theyve grown quite considerably. And with Asia in their focus now? Shoot.

The general consensus looks a little something like this though, according to quite a few people on the dota site.


It also follows with about 30 people hate bashing League and saying its the same 100,000 people with 200 accounts each, but 12 year olds will be 12 year olds. People dont argue when WoW says its got 12m subscribers, but when League, being a free to play game, shares their information, its bashed instantly. Im sure they've figured in factors such as how many level 1 accounts there are with 0 wins, or smurf accounts, for example and made their stat appropriate.


http://www.lolstatistics.com/player/na/19798104

Heres my current statistics on a website that Ive never heard of, that allows me to recheck the current stats I possess every 15 minutes. It doesnt provide every little detail like what my opponents team was, but things do exist. A little research on your part would have yielded the same results to yourself. Hate bashing a game is no way to prove yours is better.

Regarding using the amount of downloads to track DotA, I downloaded DotA but have never played it. I'm sure many people are like that as well. Similarly there are probably tons of people who have downloaded LoL and created accounts that don't really play it.

My point originally was that there is no concrete evidence to put this pissing contest to rest.

The issue is that LoL doesn't have subscribers, it has accounts. And DotA doesn't really have players, it has computers with the map, many of which have been shared to over flash drives or an intranet.

It's not a matter of bashing. Subscribers are actively paying for the game, that's pretty simple to track. Accounts? I think I have 2 different LoL accounts and I've played for maybe 10 hours in the past year: that stat is meaningless.

Those stats are useful. But then you consider that HoN at its busiest was hitting around 80,000 and has routinely hit 50,000 since moving to free to play, and that even right now when it's like 3-8 AM in Europe and China there are 175,000 people playing DotA JUST on GArena, not counting Cybercafes, Battle.net, LAN's, other private servers, etc.

If we could see how many players are playing at an average time (I think there's a way to do it just from the first two stats I quoted... but my brain hurts [maybe 216k?]), that would be comparable to other games, because that is the most frequently seen stat.

In any case, the discussion on player numbers is meaingless: here's what I initially said that was disagreed with: "There weren't any good US [DotA] teams to begin with, and neither LoL nor HoN are more competitive than DotA." Playerbase has very little to do with competition: LoL doesn't have ingame voice, it doesn't have replays, and it hasn't really encouraged competitive gameplay until this most recent $5 million blitz. It's also pay for power which is completely antithetical to competitive play. HoN is no where near as competitive because there still isn't a half-decent way for teams to compete against other teams, 2+ years after the game has been public, its metagame is still dull as shit, and it's regarded by most top DotA players as a step down strategically, probably because metagame trends from DotA hit HoN 3-4 months later.

Also: my computer flat out crashed while typing this. Firefox reopened both it and my other Firefox windows, tabs and text intact. Wow. =o

Using a third party program you can do replays, and they're relativity small too. Ingame voice is a gimmick, most competitive players would use their own third party voice client anyway. And did you seriously just call LoL pay for power? I cant remember the last time buying a skin let you get 2 more levels than everyone else in game ;o

Also whats the GArena? All I see on it is LoL and HoN.

Edit: Never mind, its just not a 'published' game, you have to play it strictly on lan. But I did find something interesting:


God damn glad Im not chinese. Some games are free to play/pay to win, this good lord. Unban card sounds like a real damn good gimmick to make cash fast.

Post has been edited 1 time(s), last time on Aug 24 2011, 3:33 am by Riney.

Runes, more available heroes, experience bonuses? Versatility is power in this genre, and flat out stat bonuses are about as "power" as it gets.

Most competitive players do use third party voice clients, but they find good players to play with in inhouses and matchmaking- which don't. Any player who has a microphone and actively uses it is already a step ahead of the curve competitively; these are the players who get noticed. As for replays I have no idea having never used it, but having to use a third party program to watch a replay was obsolete 10 years ago. If it's functional, why wasn't it built into the game in the first place? Also, I doubt LoL allows for multiple players to view a replay simultaneously, which HoN has also failed at and which should be absolutely CORE to a multiplayer competitive game.


GArena is just a client, think of it as akin to Steam. On it you can play any number of games over virtual LAN, one of which is "War3Arena", of which 99% is DotA. The bans and all that are just for GArena specifics like joining channels, it's meaningless. It's basically just a way to connect to other players from your region easily in a lag-free environment.

NDA's been lifted, so third party streams are abundant now.
http://streamdota2.com/

I guess I should see if anyone has been in the beta, but I have been gone for so long because I am enjoying DOTA2 for a few weeks.

If anyone has questions, shoot. For now:

The game is absolutely amazing. There is so much detail in this game, you won't ever be wondering, "What just happened." or "That was bullshit." The only bugs that ever come up are extreme situations, like only one hero affecting a target when they shouldn't or a buff being placed and removing another by accident, then they are fixed the following Thursday. The game is ALWAYS updated on Thursdays, without a fail, just randomly on that day.

Hey if anyone has a spare beta invite feel free to hit me up I promise to carry you to victory whenever I play with you!

@Loveless: How is balance and how is the community? I never played DotA btw.

I imagine dota2 is the most balanced and fun for classic dota players considering they have icefrog

It is the most balanced MOBA you will ever find. Everyone is extremely balanced and there are counters available to you at all times. The community is generally worse than LOL's, but less people that are full of themselves.

Bored bump. Hit me up if you got an invite for a kind person such as I.

Too late broseph. I'll hit you up if I get hold of another one.

MEANWHILE...

played 13 different heroes so far
rocking >350 GPM avg. on 8 heroes
a reasonable >300 GPM avg. on 4
10 heroes with >1 KD

GPMs generally seem a lot higher in DOTA 2 than in HoN, so maybe I'm just still doing mediocre. :[

Still, for the average game, I'm at least holding my own.

So, who's playing this?

EDIT:

hi



Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Jul 4 2012, 10:14 pm by Sand Wraith.

You know what the first three letters of Windrunner are? WIN

You know what the first four letters of Windrunner are? KAWAII