Or the summoner could just get his l4 and armor and tank the reavers, then get enough armor to tank them with lings... It is somewhat possible if done right.

Assuming the team went to counter summoner, reavers would happen early game, and he cant rush l4 that fast, because he cant exp without a bunch of upgs and mana.

Lol. Let me know when you get 110 armor on Zerglings or whatever the hell it is. The only way I've ever found that even remotely works is sending an Ultralisk in behind first and having it hold position outside of splash range. Then beat on the reaver with lings.

ETA on M8?

tonight

faz you can beat reavers b4 they get stacked up. it is rather easy if you keep them from ever stacking up which means you have to chase them down b4 they do stack. Btw you can kill them with lings also doing this. 2 waves of lings plus the initial 1 ling to draw first scarab kills one reaver with ease. Just gotta keep it from stacking. Each kill is worth a ton of exp anyway so even if it takes you 300 mana to kill one reaver its well worth it and each time after that it gets faster and easier unless they begin to pile.

Killer, your forgetting one thing

Hero Pressure - Summoner is great at evading heroes early, and killing them later, however he cant face them dead on early, so one hero defending the reaver insures its surviveability.

CAFG's post was correct, but a day early.

http://www.staredit.net/topic/8877/

Farewell, 1.4 thread.

Post has been edited 2 time(s), last time on Oct 27 2009, 4:37 am by Mini Moose 2707.

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum but i would consider myself a pro at TS and i just wanted to post my suggestion for the base capture system Moose is working on. I think you are on the right track but my issues lie on what you said would happen after the base is taken, in my opinion once the base is taken the timer should be reset to 300 and not stay at 0 or 600 like you were planning because it would take twice as long to take a base that has been captured already, I don't agree with the idea of when you are taking an opponents base and when you get the count to 300 it makes the bases neutral again. So i was thinking either set it to 300 when the base is taken and have the players capture it as they would a neutral base or when the base is taken keep it at 0/600 and make them take it at double speed (getting it to 300 does not make it neutral).

Sorry if its a little confusing, writing was my worst subject

your post belongs in the M8 thread. This thread can only really be used for M3.4 discussion now.

Whoops my bad, didn't know there was an M8 thread. Although personally i like unholy's 1.5 better.

Ew 1.5

Although it is noted that the new heroes need balancing, it's a great version.

With balancing itll become even better.

It is already supposed to go back to neutral at the halfway point. If it didn't, the entire superfluous scale itself would be superfluous.

Hmm I don't think you got what i meant but whatever, just forget i said anything. You're the expert.

I realize this is late balance and all, and probably not worth the time, but it seems like bottom has a slight advantage due to the way SC creates units.

In a game I just played, I was mech, with vult+l2. The vulture created goes directly below my vulture, and thus blocks my path when I'm trying to go down. Well typically you use l2 to chase someone, not run away from them, so typically you'll be traveling downward most of the time you use it if you're on top, and upwards if you're on bottom. Not that much of a big deal, especially considering the game is still fair. However, this obviously make it very hard to chase someone traveling downward. You have to run past them, and make them travel up, which is not always a great idea considering the vult's lack of health. To fix this, I can't think of anything, really. Ideally one could use 2 stacked vulture sprites, but of course they crash. I think 1.5 attempted to fix this via wraiths, but I'm doubtful it's worthwhile. Has this been discussed? (there's 70 pages in this thread, and I definitely haven't read it all).

The kicker is the defiler which is created when someone casts an AoE spell. On top, you're probably running towards your base, which is up. That means the defiler will probably be created below you, and thus the stun will have that extra boost to hit you. Traveling downward will likely miss, especially for some small stun like assassin. I can literally hit light mage, cast stun a split second later, and he's out of range. I realize this has been fixed, to center under the player, but which in versions is this fix effective?

It's something I've thought about, whether or not I've discussed it. It's like this for a lot of spells and would be a big reason that I would favor an east-west terrain over northwest-southeast if anyone were to remake it for some relatively distant future. Some examples:

• Medics for Medic's L1 spawn to her south side. Rarely significant, but a fact.
  
• Volt's L1 Scourges die from left to right, so there's slightly more time for Scourge on the right to travel and hit someone.
  
• Light Mage's L2 Reavers are spawned to his south side. (fixed in 1.5, M8+)
  
• Light Mage's L4 Reavers are spawned to his south side.
  
• The effectiveness (damage and trapping) of Mutant's L2 greatly varies with his position.
  
• Archer's L1 doesn't create evenly.
  
• Archer's L2 Companions spawn to his south side.
  
• Dark Mage's Orb spawned to her south side. More significant than Medic's L1, but roughly as rare.
  
• The way Dark Mage's L4 Broodlings spawn around the affected players allows them to survive easily if they are fast enough and run to the side/up. This one is perhaps the one that bothers me most.
  
• Mech's L1 Tanks spawn to its south. Sometimes it saves your life, sometimes it can trap you.
  
• Mech transforms move you to the south.
  
• Special Ops' L1 lays mines to his south side. An advantage if you're retreating north.
  

Only in M8+, as far as I know. (EDIT: Just realized this isn't the M8+ topic )

Post has been edited 3 time(s), last time on Nov 10 2009, 3:35 am by Mini Moose 2707.

The Dm's l4 is the easiest fix if you hate how they can escape just surround with first spawn of 8 broods. Personally if someone wants to run with this all the better Imo because it just spawns that many more broods. If it spawns random I don't see where it is that much different. If they do manage to escape they are only spawning more broods. Just my opinion I guess.

Well it's come at last. Temple Siege 3.4 has been Re-Stolen by Clan FH. They are a Heaven's Last Stand clan, but FH-Wally won the last TS tournament. They are calling their version 1.4MX, earlier it was called vPRO. I found it on b.net being hosted by FH-Torture with the game name "New TS!(Less Gltichy)"

Basically the only changes to the map are string changes in the form of credit stealing. UnholyUrine's name is only left in 1 spot on the map, and minimoose's credit has been removed. He also adjusted the list of names I left at the end to thank people that host TS(I put my name in one small spot in 3.4 that you'd have to open the map to see, that is now replaced with FH-Torture). Anywhere that said Clan Orig now says Clan FH, and FH-Torture has been plastered everywhere else. He also removed Pornos's credit for winning the last tournament. I thought I'd get further by putting on a mask and playing nice with the map stealer to get the whole scoop (xyoshix also joined, but was pretty much just flat out flaming him and calling him out on everything). I learned much:

I asked him what glitch exactly he fixed in 3.4, because as far as I know it only has 2, and only myself and moose know about the glitches, and no one else could even easily understand them without playing around with the map for a long amount of time.

You aren't gonna believe this but the glitch he thinks he fixed is what any competent map maker of sc player with micro skills KNOWS is a STARCRAFT GLITCH. The glitch he thinks he fixed is when you try to attack+move with a melee unit like zealot, ling, or ultra. You know when the unit freezes up and it totally fucks you over? The only way to break the freeze is to right click in the opposite direction you're facing, but FH-Torture is POSITIVE that it was CLEARLY in the triggers and has now been fixed(It's funny because I've definitely played games with moose where this would happen and the noobs would flame moose blaming it on the map, this retard took it straight into the end-zone). At this point xyoshix was bashing his head against the keyboard in rage and proceeded to get banned, but I was like "Oh wow cool really? What exactly did you change in order to fix it? No1 at SEN has ever even heard of this so you're definitely breaking new ground!"
He proceeded to tell me that it was because the units where not placed perfectly on the grids when the map was made(what happened to that trigger lol?), and that there were still some stuff, especially doodads, that could be re-placed right to "eliminate random lag spikes"

Anyways I went back to his channel and talked to fh-wally who I know to understand more about the madness, and it turns out FH-Wally is commissioning FH-Torture to make a better 3.4, unfortunately this is Torture's first foray into UMS making... I kinda got the feeling it was when he was trying to explain to what exactly he did to the map other than paste his name everywhere on it. And when when he asked how to make the leaderboard work


Some D2 player Tychus started asking him harder questions like "does TS use hypers?" "How do you even insert that into a map?" and the best revelation of all spilled from him

He isn't even editing the map himself... 90% of the stuff is done by some guy on USWest by the name of 557 he's the one that told hm and fixed the unit freeze 'glitch'.
Wally started to see just how bad everything was looking and said that it's a work in progress and all the apparent bs will be adressed, but at the same time Torture is trying to spread his version where all he did was change strings. torture will talk a lot about having the leader board also show hero kills, but that's just something he want to learn to add to some future version. Wally comes out and says exactly why they are doing what they are doing; he hates m8 with a passion

(they were talking about who they should probably give credit back to in the map, I asked them not to put my name anywhere on it)

So I try to explain to them that M8 is a sort of evolution of temple siege where new things are constantly being tried, thrown out, and polished; and is supposed to be very experimental. FH-wally, like maxx, is part of the die hard group(some would say majority) that is completely disgusted by change that isn't a bug fix. I made 3.1-3.4 for these people so they could get there classic game play desires met unglitched, so they could hopefully some day move onto m8 because they would be doing the same things over and over again. Unfortunately some how this happened, and I don't know if what I did was for the better anymore. I can't even really get mad about it because I stole M7 myself, although in my defense I'd like to add that TS was dieing, m3-m6 sucked, I didn't put my name anywhere a player would see it, and I fixed quite a few glitches that were carried over to help M8.

Oh yeah the best part, so after I ask him why he doesn't just use 3.4, he admits that they plan to change the game around a lot and add new spells.... the exact they bitch to moose about. Staggering hypocrisy even worse than mine at them stealing my stolen map.

The good news is that for the first time in a long time a true moose version is seeing a ton of play, M8e. M8e is hosted almost as much as classic versions (I'd say 40-50%), and when I say classic versions I mean 3.1-3.4 () Those 3 maps combined do seem to be hosted a little more than M8e, but they aren't being worked on and maintained like M8(9) is. I think there are 3 reasons for m8's success (in order of importance):
1) It's a good map that moose put a ton of work into
2) The first thing 3.4 tells you to do in the briefings is play M8(twice)
3) The upcoming tourny is definitely using M8

So in conclusion, I am putting my faith in the TS community to reject this bs version, and and maybe show for once that even if you steal a map, it won't get you anywhere if you haven't improved upon it.

What can I say, FH-Torture is a known douche and hacker. It's been proven on other forums as well. I am faithful to your version, and will reject this crap being made by him.